I am most curious about Helike - which I had heard as one of the possible sources for the tales.
It’s on my list of places to visit
I was really sad when I realized that most of the stories in Charles Fort were probably just small-town newspapers’ efforts to sell more copies. The evidence for Atlantis being a tall tale is pretty damn strong.
In what sense is Plato credible?
I don’t mean to be insulting, but he’s much more credible than Random Internet Guy.
“Plato using him would be like you writing a book and invoking Benjamin
Franklin as your source. You wouldn’t do it if it wasn’t true.”
Really now, I’m sure people do that all the time (Rule 34 at the very least) and don’t expect to be taken too seriously.
This seems a biggie for me. Surely if such a maritime power ever existed then there should be far more evidence of it than the most-likely-allegorical account of a single philosopher/mathematician? I mean, nobody else thought “once-mighty empire falling beneath the sea” was an event notable enough to bother writing down?
Anyone with a Facebook account could tell you that “quotes falsely attributed to Benjamin Franklin” (or many other historical figures) aren’t exactly a rare find.
Sure, but Random Internet Guy is not telling us there is some island or continent somewhere that sank beneath the sea. Or maybe he is, but nobody takes him very seriously because he offers no evidence or corroborative testimony. And he has no known geographer repute or credentials, unlike, say, Strabo. Come to think of it, neither does Plato.
Both Strabo and Plato attribute the legend to Solon, about whom much seems to be legendary. Solon himself was said to have obtained the information from Egyptian priests.
“I heard from a guy who heard from some other guys that this Atlantis thing is legit. And they would know, because a bunch of priests would never tell a story that wasn’t literally true.”
So what you are saying is atlantians are true and technologically brilliant, since they invented the game of Telephone!
There is also a nice English story about Atalantë the downfallen, a great island in the western seas destroyed when its people rebelled against the angelic powers and the shape of the world was changed. I wonder how many centuries it will take before anyone takes that author as a source of geographical lore everyone else has forgotten, the way Plato’s allegorical story is here.
Physical evidence shows us that this kind of thing does happen, so I don’t see compelling reasons to insist that it didn’t.
As far as I know, the only reason people claim the Atlantis story isn’t talking about Thera or Santorini is Plato’s (in)famous “outside the pillars of Hercules” remarks. I figure Plato was just purposely altering the location of the event in order to fictionalize it, like modern authors do. Hell, Ayn Rand’s “Fountainhead” is full of (very) thinly disguised historical events.
I have read the silmarillion many times, and it always strikes me as a humble but telling downfall. The tale is basically how kings (pharazon) become farmers (Sam gamgee), and the spirit and reflection that makes that okay.
By the end i believe, even though tolkein hated allegories, the tales are fundamentally about death and the end of faith. No matter if you are an angel/valar/numenorian/atlantian, you will eventually be tomatoes.
Yeah, I always figured that it was Thera/Santorini – to the extent that it was based upon anything real. The Minoan civilization was pretty awesome, and was certainly in contact with the Egyptians.
I wonder if the author is familiar with The Flood From Heaven by Eberhard Zangger: http://www.amazon.com/The-Flood-Heaven-Deciphering-Atlantis/dp/0688113508
it makes the case that the atlantis legend is actually an egyptian account of the Trojan War. Some key points are that the “pillars of Heracles” were not always the strait of Gibraltar- it was originally thought to be the bosphorus strait: Differences in time are accounted for by Egyptians use of a lunar calendar, rather than a solar one- so Atlantis would not have occurred as far back as we thought, bringing it to somewhat contemporary with the fall of Troy. There’s a lot of interesting stuff about the what the archeological record reveals of the structure of troy, which meshes with descriptions of how Atlantis was laid out- lastly, Troy was founded by the descendants of Atlantis. Not sure how rigorous Zangger was but it was an interesting read.
“The island must have been at war with Athens when the cataclysm occurred” and “The island must have been destroyed around 9600 BC” don’t quite jive given that the Greek civilization (or just about any civilization for that matter) didn’t yet exist then.