Hmm. So social norms have no place in your view on what is and is not appropriate?
Typically going down the street people avoid running around nude or screaming fuck. Occasionally you can see either - or both.
I think there is a certain level of politeness and adhering to societal norms. Now these may change. Perhaps nudity, with the rising climate temperatures, will be more appropriate in the future. As well as people saying, “Fuck, it’s hot outside.” But for now, I’d avoid both in polite company and public.
I reject your analogy of wanting the option to avoid seeing nude people is the same as wanting to avoid a gay black nun in a MAGA hat kissing scientists.
Another thing one might consider, within the kink community there is a big emphasis on consent. These people are not prudes - not by a long shot. But they also considerate of where they are and what they are doing to decide what level they express themselves. Making people feel uncomfortable just to be an asshole and assert your “free speach” isn’t cool.
Wow, had to look those up. The last one is pretty raunchy. Definitely not something safe for families or children. Maybe we should start a campaign (we can probably recruit the evangelicals) to get the source of that filth banned…
It’s helpful to understand social norms so that my social interactions are as frictionless as I want them to be, and I avoid unintentionally hurting other people’s feeling. But I should hope something doesn’t inform my views on what I consider appropriate just because it happens to be a social norm. Many social norms exist merely by mere coincidence, not because it’s helpful, beneficial, or even coherent. Also social norms are fluid, they exist until they change. I think it’s better to arrive at one’s own conclusion what is and is not appropriate, through observation, reflection research and dialogue. YMMV.
Politeness can mean many things, I’m not sure what it means to you. I would agree people should respect one another, and avoid being inconsiderate, but not to a point where one puts on an act.
Why would be nudity be more appropriate just because it’s hot? Is nudity more appropriate in Florida or Texas than in Alaska? As far as I understand the matter, most people who have a problem with nudity either come from some form of religious tradition, or they are simply not used to nudity. Neither will change with the climate catastrophe intensifying. And that is exactly why I don’t care much for what is considered appropriate: it has nothing to do with forming an educated opinion about something.
I think we’re coming to the misconception now. Being nude for (so-called) nudists has nothing to do with kink at all. It’s also not about other people.
That means a nude person is doing nothing to anybody else just by being nude. If that sounds strange to you, substitute “nude” with “tattooed”, dressed up as a rubber chicken", and see how that feels.
I doubt many adults are running around nude because they want to make other people feel uncomfortable. As I said, this mostly not about other people.
On a side note: kids do that, when figure out a way of making adults feel uncomfortable, they will experiment with that. E.g. say repeatedly say “fuck” in order to trigger a reaction. Often adults will use violence (not necessary physical violence) to shut that down, and that is also how social norms are taught: vulnerability leads to violence. Now is that a good social norm? I don’t think so. Again, YMMV.
However, I think if people feel uncomfortable because they see a naked person, they either have a very narrow comfort zone, or even deeper issues, and therefore I recommend they do something about it, because that is not a good and balanced state to be in. Coaches and therapists exist, they can help here.
Nudity isn’t necessarily kinky or sexual. Many things in “kink” aren’t inherently sexual either. But they can be.
When nudists are around other nudists, it’s not about other people. That is because the act is consensual among each other.
When nudists are around non-nudists it suddenly is about other people.
Well yes, they are doing something - they may be making people uncomfortable. Whether the intent is to introduce discomfort or not, it often will. Many women would find it extremely uncomfortable and a hostile act.
Do a test of 100 people and have a naked guy, a tattooed guy, and a guy dressed in a rubber chicken sit down next to someone on a train or a bus. See how many of them opt to move.
60 years ago you might have gotten more people to move away from the tattooed person as it was considered more taboo or assumed they were a criminal element (they are still shunned openly in Japan).
Again - I am all for grown adults doing what ever they want. But their interactions should be consensual.
You missed my point earlier. Because “it was hot” was given as a possible catalyst for the change of social norms. Nudity in everyday public life might become a social norm at some point. But it currently isn’t.
