And again, this is where you lose me. The best thing that could happen for working class Americans where I live is something as simple as stating that you cannot rent a property as a residence for more than one month without proof of citizenship. Hospitals, infrastructure, public services, and other aspects of daily life are significantly impacted by citizens without proper immigration status. If you’re suggesting that the United States seems to work fairly well in this state, then sir I do not know what to tell you. I cannot simply accept your unconfirmed contention that America works “relatively well”, as it ignores the exploitation of both undocumented persons and the American working class, neither of which I am willing to simply accept as a perfectly fine thing, as that idea is significantly skewed away from a reality I experience every day.
Oftentimes in situations like these it’s not necessarily that what seems like a good idea isn’t a good idea so much as “we’re saying it’s this good idea but the actual intended effect is bad thing” In this case restriction of travel within the country and fucking over people who lack documentation even more. I have a friend who’s on disability who’s without his documents (he had to move in a rush) and it’s a nightmare.
sorry, forgot the /s tag…
was definitely not a serious question.
We have a national ID, a passport.
And just because we have one doesn’t mean it is required. Freedom works like that.
Why the fuck are you so obsessed with citizens? I think you’re in the wrong country, bub. The Constitution only outlines a very small number of rights granted to citizens that aren’t granted to all people - mainly related to voting and holding federal office. Courts right on up to SCOTUS have backed that every time the Constitution of the United States uses the word “people” it means everybody, documented or not.
For a self-identified progressive, your position on immigration is repressive in the extreme.
Why are you so indifferent to the idea that national sovereignty matters?
The Constitution also says that we can’t keep British troops in your house without your permission, as a demonstration of another area where it could furiously use a quality rewrite.
Unlike Barbara Jordan, my faith in the Constitution is not total, whole, and complete.
And please, don’t suggest I’m in the wrong country. I know exactly where I am, and I know exactly how I got here.
As a citizen (naturalised), I’d rather not have people in this immigrant nation rendered homeless, transitless, untreated for disease, and children left unschooled due to accident of birth. And that’s before you get to how a national ID card would function practically in a country with this level of institutional racism still unaddressed and with private-sector social credit systems becoming stronger every day.
Where we disagree is that I believe that Nativism and national chauvinism are fundamentally incompatible with the ideals of liberal democracy and progressivism and a country that was built by and thrives because of immigrants.
Legal citizenship is not an accident of birth.
You might want to study the history of immigration in this country before you make such a grand proclamation. Then you might want to look at current events in that regard.
You might also want to allow for the fact that there are more immigration statuses in the U.S. besides citizen and undocumented. By limiting your terminology, you’re talking about denying long-term housing to permanent residents, international students, people who are here on work visas (like our moderator), etc.
Also, the barriers to attaining legal citizenship are needlessly difficult and complicated even if you’re an educated and affluent white-presenting guy who speaks English better than 99% of the America First crowd, let alone a poor PoC. Ask me how I know.
Well it depends. Do you want to fly? Yeah better have that. Even domestically as Real ID is a requirement.
You could drive if you have a car and a drivers license but you are not crossing any borders.
edit international borders that is.
What irks me most about states rights is the phenomenon of model legislation. Theoretically dual sovereignty enables the citizens of a particular state to tailor their system of government to local realities-- Alaskans have different needs and outlooks, and expertise than Floridians.
Yet many of the most far reaching bills are promulgated as model legislation by national groups-- ALEC is the most notorious, but is only one of them.
And different flavors of enfranchisement for citizenships.
If you’re in Puerto Rico - you don’t have equal voting rights- move to NY? You do.
DC? No real representation in Congress- but you can vote for Prez.
Hey, I love national sovereignty. Anybody who wants to join Team USA is better in my book than people who take their privilege for granted; or even worse, as some kind of sign of superiority.
Don’t underestimate the value of that protection - it’s not just against quartering British troops, but any troops. Maybe you’d have more faith in it if you understood it better?
Just letting you know that your determination to shut the door behind you looks really racist, whether that’s your intent or not.
Why is that? As long as someone pays the agreed upon fees for their dwelling, what does it matter?
How’s that now? The vast majority of undocumented immigrants still pay taxes. Almost nobody is immune from the sales taxes that fund your precious public services, but they also pay federal income taxes a well. The myth that all undocumented immigrants are paid under the table while giving nothing back is just that – a myth.
What does that have to do with any of your other arguments? Exploitation of workers is a function of those in power. Yet you’re arguing that undocumented immigrants are exploiting everybody. I’m not even sure what you’re trying to argue here short of regurgitating Fox News talking points.
Looks like 90% of U.S. citizens got their citizenship instantly upon being born, so … of course it is
TSA’s pay-to-play PreCheck scheme was always a cynically self-serving measure: it reduced dissatisfaction among the well-heeled travelers who could cause the most political trouble for them, leaving the proles to stand in the second-class-citizen take-your-shoes-off line.
And now taking away PreCheck is being used as a cudgel against political enemies. Nobody could have seen that coming.
I lived in Germany for two years and only brought my passport out when I was leaving or returning to the country. My nephew is going to university in Japan. He doesn’t need his passport to do anything, again, unless it’s to leave or return to the country.
What do you think people in those countries need ID for - buying cereal?
What law enforcement agency could seize Trump Tower under civil forfeiture law as the proceeds of criminal activity? And if Trump wanted it back, well, sorry the computers crashed when we asked how much Trump Tower was worth so we’ll just have to guess. We’ll go by your public statements about how much Trump Tower is worth rather than how much you claim it’s worth on your tax forms.
I see someone “worrying” that much about it, and I assume they are profiting from it.
