Could we posit though that the effort to place things in question form produces kinder, gentler disagreements on average though?
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it also is exhausting?
Yes, but won’t it be exhausted only when there are no questions left?
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That’s not even possible, is it?
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Then hadn’t we better get busier?
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Isn’t this an enduring motto of mine?
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Why can’t I vote on the ‘kiss and make up’ poll? (I was going for ‘super yes’ btw, and particularly looking forward to the ‘make up’ portion of the outcome. Which involved a lot of cosmetics in my imagination.)
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In this case, would we be the institution in question? (We, the target audience, who have selected by box-office vote the pool of “big name” actors?)
Could it be unrealistic to expect people in Hollywood to stake their reputations, and many millions of dollars, on a decision that may be morally admirable but is financially risky?
Is the solution to this that more and more people stop watching movies where decisions like these have been made so cynically?
Would it be too much to add that questioning makes it hard for me not to feel like a condescending faux-Socratic jerk?
ETA: Is it because of this thread I was thinking about this just last week?
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Yes, but it’s also true that the problem has historically been black/brown/yellow face and demeaning roles for POC, right? [quote=“d_r, post:1066, topic:76536”]
What is the lesson to be gleaned from the fact that the excellent Indian film industry and Korean TV industry, both populated by fantastic actors, have 20% more viewers than their Hollywood counterparts but still gross less money?
[/quote]
Wouldn’t I agree that it has to do with the power of the American state to open up foreign markets for our cultural products in the first place, which has given Hollywood an unfair advantage in a global marketplace for films and the perception that Hollywood makes “universal” films? Also, didn’t Hollywood have a huge head start?
Wouldn’t I agree with this partial, but at the same time, the decisions made on the production end aren’t necessarily ours, but are made by assumptions about what we’ll consume?
I don’t know - should it be unrealistic to expect people to sometimes do the right thing? What about TV shows that are wildly popular with stars that are POC, such as Scandal or How To Get Away with Murder - not to mention Empire? What about the powerhouse that is Shondaland? Or shows that have casts that aren’t all white, such as Walking Dead or GOT?
Don’t I agree and don’t I also think that speaking out about white-washed casting is part of the solution?
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Why are all the polls in this thread broken?
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@japhroaig fat-fingered the DNS again?
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If you are asserting that Hollywood has a long history of marginalizing or caricaturing certain groups, then how can I deny an obvious truth? But don’t I also think that the reasons for this are complex and deep, and for example the use of Jewish and Italian actors in the 1930s to portray Native Americans falling off their horses while being shot by Western heroes represents such a complex matrix of problems that the portrayal of one marginalized ethnic group by another slightly-less-marginalized ethnic group was a relatively tiny piece of the problem?
But doesn’t your second sentence here speak to the first? Isn’t part of the solution to develop and showcase talent as part of the diversification of the industry, and isn’t that happening sometimes?
Did you see Aloha? Would you believe that here in Hawaii the discussion of the film was more nuanced than the discussion elsewhere in the country?
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Is it because I cried about it, since a dearth glut of polls tends to break my dumb browser?
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Uhg, isn’t white meat the worst meat?
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Worse than chitterlings, even?
Because don’t I think that intestines are a body part that should never be eaten, unless under absolute duress?
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Did I ever say it wasn’t? [quote=“d_r, post:1078, topic:76536”]
the portrayal of one marginalized ethnic group by another slightly-less-marginalized ethnic group was a relatively tiny piece of the problem?
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Agreed, but at the root it’s still white supremacy that’s the problem, no? Doesn’t the structures set up by white supremacy reinforce, not binaries, but hierarchies, which allow more privileged groups within that hierarchy to exploit less privileged groups? Don’t I understand that? But at the end of the day, shouldn’t we still oppose whitewashing, such as in this case we’re discussing? If people don’t comment on such things, how will people in Hollywood know that we demand better casting choices that better reflect a diverse society?
Aren’t I afraid I haven’t?
Why wouldn’t I believe that? Wouldn’t I assume that the discussion centered on Hawaii’s diverse population and the relationship between Native Hawaiians and all the other groups of people who were there as a by product of Western imperialism and capitalism?
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Would you believe this is the first time I have seen this written out? And that mentally I’ve always spelled it “chitlins”?
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I can totally believe that, can’t I?
Isnt that how it’s generally pronounced despite being spelled so differently?
And isn’t the English language weird, when it gives us words that sound NOTHING like how they are spelled?
Like for instance, bologna?
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But in the case of the '30s movies, wasn’t it more a matter of convenience than white supremacy? And weren’t the directors themselves often immigrants or from marginalized groups?
[quote=“anon61221983, post:1082, topic:76536”]
Wouldn’t I assume that the discussion centered on Hawaii’s diverse population and the relationship between Native Hawaiians and all the other groups of people who were there as a by product of Western imperialism and capitalism?[/quote]
Then would you be surprised to learn that local criticisms of the movie, which after all featured several sovereignty activists playing themselves in major and sympathetic roles, were largely free from this particular jab?
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When there are no polls your dumb browser breaks?
If it keeps on pollin’ browser’s goin’ to break
If it keeps on pollin’ browser’s goin’ to break
When the browser breaks I’ll have no net to read.
Mean old browser taught me to weep and moan
Lord mean old browser taught me to weep and moan
Got what it takes to make a mountain woman leave his home
Oh well oh well oh well.
Don’t it make you feel bad
When you’re tryin’ to find your way home
You don’t know which way to go?
If you’re goin’ down South
They go no work to do,
If you don’t know about Chicago.
Cryin’ won’t help you, prayin’ won’t do you no good,
Now, cryin’ won’t help you, prayin’ won’t do you no good,
When the browser breaks, mama, you got to move.
All last night read the browser and moaned,
All last night read the browser and moaned,
Thinkin’ ‘bout me baby and my happy home.
Going, go’n’ to Chicago,
Go’n’ to Chicago,
Sorry but I can’t take you.
Going down, going down now, going down
going down now, going down, going down, going down, going down
Going down, going down now, going down
going down now, going down
going down now, going down
Going d-d-d-d-down
Woo woo
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