Tree of liberty fertilized with the
blood of the innocent
yada yada yada.
The internet is so much nicer to look at when you run Adblock Plus.
You can pry rape from their cold, dead handsā¦ or something?
Donāt be asinine Brainy - the thousands of weapons are for protection from the crazy guy who only shot himself. Imagine the injustice if you happened to catch a flesh-wound ricochet without being able to shoot the dead guy back!
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You need to spell out for the hard of thinking that the ownership of guns is not restricted to nice people. In fact, they are more likely to be owned by fearful and violent people - like rapists.
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You misunderstand my remarks; I donāt have a problem with gun regulation. But it should be applied evenly across all populations, not depending on whether someone happens to live on a campus or not.
Letās take for example another constitutional right; the Fourth Amendment. We donāt allow schools to declare āconstitution free zonesā with regard to search and seizure; students (even high school students) have a protected expectation of privacy in their person and possessions, and at residential schools, in their dorm/dwelling.
If the right to bear arms is individual, and applies to all citizens, then restricting that right in the āprivate cityā that college campuses have become, and where students are often required to live, seems inequitable. One should not have to choose between a higher education and the recognition of their rights.
I get that you may not like guns, and that you may not believe that the right is individual. But thatās the law of the land at this point. Itās also the law that some institutions can declare that they do not allow guns on the premises. And I repsect that and that its a wise policy to allow that in many circumstances. But when that restriction affects an entire class of people it starts to look like discrimination - not necessarily against a protected class, but discrimination nonetheless.
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(Disclaimer: I am strongly opposed to private gun ownership anywhere near me. But as I am comfortably far away from the nearest Texan university campus, I can file this under ārespect for other culturesā)
Iām not sure if your Fourth Amendment example is entirely valid:
Do you not? Locker searches, or metal detectors at the entrance?
Are supermarket cashiers allowed to have a quick glance into my backpack at checkout?
Also note that there is no right to free speech at a classical music concert, because if you insist on speaking (about anything at all) during the concert, they will probably kick you out.
But you do have a point here. Too many rights are lost because we spend our time under the power of some organisation which is not technically part of the government.
There used to be a fundamental right to peacefully assemble in a public place, such as the main shopping street downtown, and make your opinions about current political issues known to everyone. The right still exists, but how much is it still worth when people do their shopping in a privately-owned shopping mall or at amazon.com?
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Lockers are school property, technically, and have different standards than the person, possessions, or dorm. Metal detectors are justified as a reasonable security measure in certain circumstances just like they are at airports, also, courts have found that the standards for people under 18 are lower, I beleive, but not that they donāt have any rights at all.
As for the supermarket question, actually that answer is no, they donāt have a right to search your bag or your person. They can ask, but you can refuse. In some jurisdictions a shopkeeper could detain you if they suspected you were stealing, and have the police search you when they got there. But in other states even that isnāt allowed. I routinely blow past those receipt checkers in stores because I think theyāre offensive and waste my time, and nobody can stop me.
Itās already legal in 20 other states.
Iām amused at the number of people losing their shit over this. It isnāt as if people arenāt already legally carrying everywhere else but campus. Back when concealed carry was first proposed in Texas people talked about how it would be a return to the wild west and weād have shootouts in the streets and bodies stacked up like cordwood. It simply hasnāt happened. People crying about the impending disaster donāt realize theyāre already already sitting in restaurants and shopping for groceries with people who carry. Itās still restricted to people who are 21 and over. If you enter college at 18 then youād be a senior and near graduation at 21, the youngest you can legally carry. Despite the cries of alarm, this change would only impact a small part of the student population.
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In Texas, this bill restricts campus carry to those over the age of 21 who have taken a government mandated course including marksmanship test and passed a background check. Itās a straw man argument to say ādumb college kids carrying gunsā. The permit, class, firearm, and holster are also above the typical "broke dumb college student"budget, effectively poll taxing and limiting access.
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I attend college in Texas.
In Texas, to get a CHL you just be 21 years old or older. So this is not going to arm 18,19, or 20 year old students.
Iām a bit older, as I am back for a second degree and a change of career field. I have been legally carrying concealed since the 90s. It seems odd that the state is fine with me carrying up until I step out of my car in the parking lot on campus, then I am suddenly a menace to society.
I hesitate to even mention this, but a small factor for me wanting to carry on campus is clothing related. My pistol and holster are about an inch and a half wide. 40mm. In order to fit, I have to buy pants that are a size larger in the waist. Since I have been carrying since the 90ās I donāt think I own a pair of pants that are not one size too big. So on days I go to class, I leave my pistol in my car, or at home, but then my damn pants keep falling down. Which I know is the style in some places, but is not one I like. Also it feels weird to not be carrying, kinda like when you leave your wallet at home accidentally and then your pants feel funny because itās not there. Like I said itās a minor issue, but it is an issue, so I thought Iād mention it. Although I really donāt like having to leave my pistol in the car, even though I have bolted a safe in the trunk, I still donāt like the idea that its now easier to steal it.
The students I see pushing for concealed carry are people like myself who are older and have a license already, the grad students who stay on campus late then walk to their car and have to drive home probably to a sketchy neighborhood (itās tough to live in a non sketchy neighborhood as a broke ass grad student), and the ladies who have restraining orders against violent exes.
One of my classmates in Intro to Engineering was in her late 20s and just going through a divorce and her ex was quite violent. Heād put her in the hospital one too many times, so she finally got up the nerve to leave him. And he was piiiiised about that. He came on to campus a few times and messed with her car. She was scared shitless that he was going to kill her. So she got a license to carry, but then had to leave the gun in her car in the parking lot, and she was very afraid that he would attack her when she was unarmed. He knew she had a license and he knew she could not carry on campus. She had the campus cops escort her to her car every evening at first, but then after a week or so they stopped doing that for her. Until he messed with her car again, then theyād do it for another week or so.
Since Iām older, about their dadās age, and married and a little dorky looking, I think for those reasons anyway, the younger students in my classes often come to me for advice. She did, and asked what to do?
What should I have said? What would you tell her?
Last semester in intro to mechanical engineering on of my classmates had a guy stalking her. Sheād never gone on a date with him, but he thought they had a relationship and she was afraid he would get violent. She is 17, maybe 18 now, so could not legally carry a handgun anyway, but wanted some advice. I suggested her only legal option was pepper spray and or a stun gun.
Also last semester the grad student in charge of one of the labs I was in mentioned that he had to sell his car because he hadnāt been paid since June(telling us this in November) and had been mugged twice since he sold it and had to walk home very late at night when he left the research lab.
My own situation is kinda interesting. Iām in my 40ās, six foot, 220 pounds. Iām not worried about being mugged, nothing in my wallet is worth shit, and I donāt have anyone stalking me or a crazy ex. But my wife does. And he just got out of prison for putting his wife in the hospital and doing a lot of damage to her. And he mentioned to a friend of a friend that he knew weād had a son, and he was going to kill me because I stole āhisā son. Now, is a dude that fucking crazy going to be stopped from doing violence to me because legally he canāt carry on campus? Nope. Iām not too worried as he lives eight hours away, but he knows I carry, as the one and only time I have met him it was mentioned, and he knows I go to school, damn mother in law keeps bragging on me, and he knows I canāt carry on campus so if heās at all smart and at all serious, his best choice of places to attack me is on campus. Like I said, Iām not too worried about him, all his violence so far has been against women, and heās on the other side of the state, but then again Iām the guy that has two spare tires because of that one time when I was in the middle of nowhere and I got two flats.
As far as carrying to a frat party, legally if I am carrying I canāt drink alcohol. Nor can I carry into a bar, even if I am not drinking. This may have changed recently, but at least as of the last time I renewed my license this was the law. Since the definition of bar is fairly open, I would assume Iād be prohibited from carrying at a frat party.
In the nineties when we allowed concealed carry there were predictions of all kinds of violence, that the streets would run red with the blood of innocents as every fender bender would turn into a gunfight, etc. That did not happen, and now we have twenty ish years of data showing that concealed carry license holders are pretty dang law abiding people. I donāt foresee gunfights on campus every day if this law is passed.
Oh, also in this legislative session (every two years in Texas) is a bill to allow open carry. I am for open carry. Not because I want to walk around like a cowboy with my six shooter on my belt for everyone to see. Right now the way the law works here is that if my pistol is ever visible I am breaking the law. So I wear untucked shirts that are longish to hide the grip. But sometimes when I get out of the car my shirt has ridden up a little and until I tug it back down my pistol is visible and I am technically breaking the law. Same thing when I reach for an item on a shelf and my shirt rides up. Also to aid in concealment I carry my pistol inside the waistband of my pants, so the holster and the pistol is subjected to my sweat more than if they were on the outside of my pants. Texas is hot, and sadly my sweat is pretty acidic and it tends to rust metal, like a gun, pretty quickly. It would be much better if I could carry on the outside of the belt, but still under the shirt, but right now if I do that any motion that causes my shirt to ride up a little bit will expose the holster and that breaks the law. So thatās my reasoning for wanting open carry.
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Literally every time a state has passed concealed carry legislation, open carry legislation, or constitutional carry legislation, people have been predicting problems, blood in the streets, shootout at the OK Corral,etc. Utah and Colorado already allow carry on campuses. Idaho does with an enhanced permit. Virginia has permitless open carry, and shall issue concealed carry. The majority of the country allows concealed carry of firearms on a shall-issue basis, and the only places itās totally illegal are DC & some of the overseas territories. From this, weāve gathered the following info:
Concealed carry permit holders are more law abiding than the general population.
In fact, theyāre less likely to commit a crime of any kind than a police officer is to commit a domestic violence infraction.
Concealed Carry permit holders are less likely to shoot an innocent bystander than a police officer, and are held more accountable when they do.
Crime rates continue to drop (as has been the general trend) when the above legislation is passed, which at a minimum means the āblood in the streetsā just isnāt happening.
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The only way to stop a bad student with a gun is a good student with a badder gun. Or such-like. ā Pepe LaPewierre
Or, just improvise your own, more modern non-ballistic weapons and avoid all of the bureaucracy.
And any 1 of them, in turn, could only impact several dozen. Those within range at the very most.
Thanks for the post, that was very informative!
Meanwhile, black people canāt even carry toy guns in the toy section of the toy store, without getting shot on sight by cops.
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Or, in other words, people still let their feral police kill the unarmed without intervening.
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There was also a recent case where a law abiding elderly black concealed carry permit holder was assaulted by some anti-gun nutbag
You need to move to the south side of Chicago, where daily life is significantly safer than the hellhole you seem to live in.
