The cops who shot a homeless man have been charged with murder

I had watched that video when it first came out and yes, indeed, it’s sickening.

But something I just noticed: the two guys up the hill had clear shots at the guy, but the guy from whose perspective the video is being shot is shooting right past the two guys (I’ll accept there might be some distortion from the lens). That in itself shows a pretty ridiculous loss of control there. You’ve got two guys who have a clear shot, but shooter number three puts his partners at risk by getting in on the action? That’s just so gratuitous. Your buddies are shooting so you are going to take a few shots, too, just because? That’s awfully bad training.

I hope they spend a long, long time in jail.

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Well, people are locked up at the state facilities for being a danger to themselves or others. The place I have spent most of my time that is a state facility, here in Charlotte, NC, has two units. One is a complete lock down with the most dangerous patients. That is not a fun place to be. The second unit is for those that are getting ready to be released and is more lax in its security. Either way, you are not allowed outside except to the recreation area that is a small fenced in area right outside the edge of the hospital. for about an hour a day. There were two TVs on the second unit, but not much to read except women’s magazines, and a few books. I read all of the National Geographics that they had, =)

I have a feeling that there are a lot more “dangerous to others” in the US than Finland, and that is why you have such lax security. I’m not trying to insult you here, BTW.

I don’t know what the answer is. Personally, I love my once a month shot of Invega that does not allow me to skip or stop doses. Bottom line is that the state hospitals are like jails, but better than the private for-profit hospitals, as the state wants to integrate you into society and the private facilities just want to suck all the money out of you.

We also have our facilities divided into two parts; one for those who are either a real danger to themselves or others, and one for other patients. The patients in the tight security area are not allowed outside either and they have very restricted policies about what they can do. So it’s not that different. I also don’t see why we would have less dangerous patients in Finland than in the US .- I mean, obviously we have a smaller population, but proportionally speaking, I see no reason why we would have less serious cases,

I just think that we treat out patients a little more humanely. The goal is always integration into society. We have no private facilities here, it’s all run by the government. And I’m glad of all the support and money I’ve gotten so I can become a good, tax-paying citizen. Hurray for socialism?

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Well, the USA has a higher rate of murder than Finland, almost three times the rate. I’m just saying that violent crime is much more prevalent in the USA than Finland, so I extrapolate that there are more violent mental health patients in the USA.

I should have said more violent mental health patients per capita in the USA than Finland, so by per capita the mental health facilities have proportionally more violent patients.

Original thread here. I wonder if Mr Cat_Shannon will grace us with his wisdom and insight once again.

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Just read that. And now I get my first “christ, what an asshole.” I get his “guys with knives are dangerous and can cover ground quick” screed, but yeah, this is not that.

If it is to change it probably won’t be up to them, according to something I read yesterday the APD is so problem plagued, particularly with shooting people, that they were forced into federal oversight of some kind and are getting a shakeup.

Could amount to nothing tho, like most local police oversight commissions do, they being federalis may not mean shit

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There are a lot of cultural factors behind the higher violent crime rates in the US. Failure to properly treat mental illness is one of those factors.

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Well, that’s one of the emotions that leads one to breath hard behind a camera, but there are others…

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@IronEdithKidd really said it well:

I agree with you @johnphantom that things are probably worse in American insitutes. But when I talked about how mental health treatment is handled in Finland, I was just triýing to point out that it could be better. It can be done in a more humane way. Sadly, that’s not the case in America right now, and I don’t really have high hopes that it’s gonna change anytime soon.

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My guess is it’s because they just climbed an upslope on the hill where that guy was camping.

They didn’t seem all that excited to me. Listening to them talk after, it’s like they were discussing how to change the toner in the copy machine. Just another day at the office.

Just some time would be a pleasing start, given the normal outcome…

Perhaps we should quit providing the mentally ill with guns and badges.

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Cops demand criminals get harsher punishment when a cop is attacked, harsher then when a criminal attacks a civilian. The same should apply when cops commit crimes - in fact, they should get an even harsher punishment, since cops are entrusted to know and uphold the law.

A message needs to be sent to cops across the US that crimes committed by cops are worse than crimes committed by other criminals. The death penalty is still on the books in Arizona.

Execution is the solution.

Indeed.

The indictment is an amazing thing in and of itself.

A conviction would be even better.

A sentence commensurate with the crime might qualify as a miracle.

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There are differences between mentally ill, malevolent, and negligent. They’ve nailed the last one, based on what we see here; a good case can be made for the second; and the first… never even enters the picture.

Because after all, if they were mentally ill, some other yahoo out there would demand that we feel compassion for them, too, and that’s a huge, dehumanising ask.

No, the solution to state sanctioned murder is not more state sanctioned murder.

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The above are is the only two sentences part of your post with which I disagree. Everything else is spot-on, IMO.

Edit to clarify: I do not challenge that Arizona still has the death penalty, but rather that the solution would be to apply it to cops (or anyone).

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Strongly disagreed. I think execution is inhumane (some might say that prisons are too, but they aren’t if they’re done right) and belongs in the 19th century. Most countries have done away with it completely; I wish the US would too.

I do, however, completely agree that cops who commit violent crimes should be punished more severely than regular citizens. Meaning longer sentences. Of course, the problem is that they aren’t being prosecuted at all to begin with. Maybe we (meaning you, I’m not American) should start there.

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