This is where I think you’re being woefully incorrect. With the infinite amount of things Trump has done as a candidate and as president that would have sunk anybody else in an instant, somehow he’s still here. A crappy economy isn’t any more likely to hurt him politically (especially when he can just pass the blame to some scapegoat and his base will nod in agreement), and is far more likely to hurt the rest of us literally.
Wishing for an economic collapse, pandemic, terrorist attack, etc just because it could help score points for another candidate is an awful and heartless thing to do. It’s something I’d expect from someone on the right.
In a recession, “this sucks” for you can be a life or death scenario for someone else.
The economy is literally the only thing this guy has going for him and he didn’t even put it in the position to receive credit for it. Nate Silver and several experts have said if the bottom falls out of the economy, it’s over for Trump. All the people like in that CNN clip will vote against Trump even if they harbor reservations for someone like Bernie Sanders.
I don’t think 4 more years of Trump is a survivable event.
Someone who takes millions away from the CDC to funnel into taxcuts.
Someone who asserts as president they can do whatever they want.
Someone who funnels taxpayer dollars right into his corporations pockets.
Someone who insists on loyalty and hollows out the government i.e. firing everyone who disagrees with them. This is what dictators do, surrounding themselves with Yes Men.
Someone who says even if he loses the election, won’t leave office.
Someone who’s supporters threaten to and carry out attacks on their opponents.
Someone who’s anti-science to the extent they’re hiding vital information from experts about the coronavirus behind the US classification system i.e. confidential secret top secret.
Someone who’s administration has eroded are system of justice to not only enhance the powers of the presidency to levels they were never intended to but, actively pardons criminals and other such that were responsible for not only committing acts that lead to the last financial crisis but, looted a childrens hospital of millions of dollars.
Someone who sells access to the president, yes like a dictator.
Someone who equates Neo Nazis, White Supremacists, and Skinheads to counter protestors, amid an incident that lead to a girl being run over by a car.
So it’s cool for the economy to collapse and bring untold pain and suffering to a vast majority of Americans because it might hurt Trump politically. Gotcha.
The alternative being he gets re-elected, never leaves office, and becomes dictator for life? Cheating our Justice System, Separation of Powers, and Democracy in one fell swoop?
I think Nate Silver is a generally smart guy but at this point in the 2016 election cycle he was still reassuring everyone how unlikely a Trump win would be in the first place.
If there’s been one consistent theme in Trump’s political career it’s that the old rules no longer apply.
I don’t think we knew about the Russian Propaganda, election hacking, and voter suppression i.e. to what extent all of that existed. Also remember we’ve recently learned the Russia, Saudi Arabia, and China smuggled millions of dollars into Trumps campaign i.e. through illegal wire transfers.
Who’s to say that won’t happen anyway? And your rooting for an economic collapse on the hope that it might benefit Trump’s opponent is the exact kind of disgusting and perverse nihilistic bullshit that helped get Trump elected in the first place.
I honestly don’t think it would have made much difference in Trump’s support if we had known.
First, few Trump supporters then or now would ever admit—even to themselves—that they were gullible enough to be influenced by propaganda from hostile foreign governments.
Second, we know for a fact that Trump’s supporters stuck by him through countless scandals that would have tanked any other political campaign in American history. The Access Hollywood tape alone would have been enough to destroy any other Presidential candidate in living memory.
That’s where your logic has fallen. Nobody said “collapse is good” and that’s not what is happening. How about correction? Collapse is zero or very nearly zero. Collapse is broken beyond repair. What is happening this week is a pullback. It’s not collapse. It’s called recession because the tide will one day progress again. What you’re doing is extremifying. It’s incorrect and inaccurate. There is no evidence to support your position that it is collapse. Because it isn’t.
PS, those aren’t the people at stake. It is the occasional voters who can be swayed the other way. And there are many more of them than the die-harders. Those are the people on Wall Street who voted no confidence today, and the people who will switch to D on November 3rd.
Every single person who voted for Trump in 2016 voted for him in spite of countless scandals. The racism, the sexism, the financial scandals, the reprehensible personal conduct, the disdain for rule of law.
They voted for him after he retweeted White Supremacist propaganda and quoted Mussolini.
They voted for him after he mocked POWs and attacked Gold Star families.
They voted for him after he broke his promises to share his tax returns and was sued for fraud.
They voted for him after he was credibly accused of sexual assault by dozens of women, even bragging about it on tape.
They voted for him after he mocked a disabled reporter at one of his own rallies.
But sure, a dip in the Dow is gonna turn a whole bunch of those voters right around, because at their hearts they are reasonable people who just needed a nudge to switch to the other side.
While I agree with the sentiment, you should produce evidence that this is true if you believe it to be fact and not opinion. You are still describing the die-harders. You are not describing the people in the rust belt states who felt caught between a perceived Democrat who they thought would do them wrong vs. a possible Republican who might not. Again, their perception, not mine. And it’s what decided 2016. This is a fact, not an opinion. 70,000 of them put Trump there. Not die-harders. These are the people who will face the recession and think, hrm, maybe Bernie/Warren/Biden/etc won’t make it worse.
I just gave you a significant (if hardly exhaustive) list of major Trump scandals that preceded the 2016 election. By definition, none of those scandals were sufficient to dissuade even one of the people who voted for him from doing so. That is a statement of fact, not opinion.
I can’t believe I have to argue basic logic this way, but will you accept the axiom [thing that objectively happened] was not prevented by [prior things that happened]?
If so, then yes. By definition, Trump’s scandals prior to the 2016 election did not prevent those who voted for him in the 2016 election from doing so.
If you can’t agree that’s a “factual statement,” then we have a fundamental disagreement on what “factual statement” means and I see no point trying to continue this discussion.
I don’t know too many regular people who own stock. My 92 year old union grandpa doesn’t either. I talked to him today and he said he hopes it crashes too. He says that the damage Trump is doing to the country won’t be easily repaired, especially if he gets another 4 years. My grandfather grew up during the Great Depression and lived through the Vietnam War period, he says he’s never seen it (i.e. the country) this bad.
