Mad magazine is ending. I think now is a good time to end the Simpsons too.
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Some men just want to watch the world burn…
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It’s probably worth pointing out that not all Indian-Americans find the Apu character ‘problematic’. He seems to have quite a large support base there in fact, I remember seeing a lot of support on twitter back when the controversy about this broke the first time. Partially because he was a stereotype (like every other character in the show), and stereotypes are so frequently based in reality, he provided a recognisable figure for many Indian-Americans. His mostly positive character traits, of hard-work and devotion to his family, stand in stark contrast to most of the feckless white characters also.
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I’m white so have no right to “authority” in this discussion. I’d love to hear more of what Indian-Americans feel about Apu.
To me, he is a positive character in a sea of dumb characters, and I love him since the Simpsons was part of my childhood. Of course, I haven’t seen a Simpsons TV episode in probably 15 years. But again - if he’s truly hurtful I’d like to hear that, from those he hurts, not a bunch of other white people.
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The show does not exist in a vacuum. The show’s creators are smart enough to realize the long-standing impact that the character has had on Indian Americans, especially in light of the documentary. They just choose not to do anything about it.
Likewise, the show’s creators are smart enough to know that it’s downright sad when entertainers continue relying on outdated stereotypes just for a cheap laugh, but they lack either the self-reflection or the will to do anything about that either.
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Have you listened to what Hari Kondabolu had to say on the subject? Either his documentary, or any of his other discussions of the topic?
His analysis is much more nuanced than the simplistic arguments being attacked in this thread.
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from the Guardian article I just linked:
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Don’t like Apu on the Simpsons? Don’t watch the Simpsons. It hasn’t been good in like 10-15 years. Just let it die it’s slow but steadily approaching inevitable death. Check out the chart with the ratings. It’s only a matter of time.
“We could normalize Simpsons episode ratings by the declining top 30 curve to adjust for the fact that it’s more difficult for any one show to capture as large a share of the TV audience over time. But as mentioned earlier, the normalization would only account for about a 50% decline in ratings since 1989, while The Simpsons ratings have declined more like 80-85% over that horizon.”
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Matt Groening does not want to remove Apu
That’s the opposite of what the article says
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The fact of the matter is that I did not know who Mr Kondabolu was until he complained about Apu in the Simpsons
But now I do
Mission accomplished I guess
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What does the degree of a person’s celebrity have to do with the validity of their position?
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While the ratings have certainly declined, they’re still pretty high relative to other shows currently airing, and the Simpsons still generates huge revenue for Fox outside of direct ad revenue (see the Tapped Out game referenced in The Bizarre Modern Reality of The Simpsons video above for a good example of this), it’s not going anywhere any time soon.
I kept watching the show long after the supposed peak of season 12 (and I don’t agree this was the peak, it continued to be great for many seasons after that), from season 18 or so it was mostly out of loyalty, because the show got increasingly patchy, and some seasons really were terrible with only a handful of watchable episodes, most of the last 10+ years has been very forgettable, though even then some seasons have been better than others, and there’s always at least a few decent episodes. It’s only in the last couple of seasons that loyalty alone hasn’t been enough to keep me watching. I think I’m about two seasons behind now, and I’m not sure if I’ll ever watch those episodes.
Good link.
It might have helped if Kondabolu spoke to a different set of people about what Apu meant to them. The Problem with Apu mostly interviews famous Indian-American actors. The people who seem the least fazed by seeing an Apu clip are Kondabolu’s parents. I imagine most Indian-Americans feel the same way.
But hey, luckily we got more than Apu nowadays. We got Mindy Kaling, Aziz Ansari – and don’t let the white devils make you forget that Sir Ben Kingsley is really Krishna Pandit Bhanji.
Good to read different Indian perspectives, and I did not know that about Ben Kingsley.
Edit:
I feel like the vitality and passion of the The Simpsons moved to Futurama.
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Doesn’t the fact that he had to change his name and obscure his heritage to make it big in Hollywood an argument against the idea that South-Asians have been getting adequate representation in Hollywood?
It’s like citing Martin Sheen as evidence that latinx people have been getting adequate representation in film and television for the last 40 years. Yeah, sure a Mexican-American can play the lead in a 1970s war epic or play the President in a 1990s TV drama… as long as most viewers don’t realize he’s Mexican-American.
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Oh, absolutely. It’s like Rita Hayworth. I don’t think that author would disagree. I think the “white devils” line was largely a joke, but I had not known that about Kingsley (who apparently has a lot to say about his relationship with India — I’ll have to check it out later).
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Which is exactly why he doesn’t go by his given name of Ramón Estévez. He wouldn’t have been able to get work when he was up and coming. He’s been very open about this.
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What exactly is the racist stereotype about Apu? Is it that he is an Indian with an Indian accent working at a convenience store? That’s actually just a common thing in America. It’s been a couple of decades since I watched the Simpsons but I always recalled them making Apu a fully fleshed out and sympathetic character.
If anything Apu is usually the foil on which they skewer racism. How many scenes have Apu frustrated and annoyed by the ignorance and idiocy of others? Something having some stereotypical traits doesn’t make it racist, sexist, or whatever. Sometimes you recognize stereotypes because they have elements of truth. A lot of Indian people to in fact have an Indian accent, and work in service industry jobs. There is clearly a lot more to Apu than those facts, in The Simpsons as a good job conveying that.
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Read the discussion above re: the specific criticism.
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But any fleshing out, if anything, just offsets the cheap laughs they are coasting on from Hank Azaria doing the accent and catch-phrase + stereotypical bits. If this character were to get in the black in terms of racial/ethnic representation, they would have at least had him voiced by an actual South Asian.
[ETA: whiiiich, now that I’m reading it, is covered int he above linked New Yorker article and is basically the main point of the movie…so yeah, what he said]
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There’s something about the current agreement for production and syndication where it expires in 2023 if production of the show stops and Disney can then go shop a more lucrative deal.
I get what you’re saying about the merchandising and tie ins. It would be interesting to note if Apu has been quietly taken out of “circulation,” but won’t be acknowledged by the creators because it would piss off a portion of their remaining audience.
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