You might be the only person willing to publicly admit to having seen Ultraviolet.
20 Likes
Iâd watch Milla Jovovich in pretty much anything. As demonstrated by my having watched Ultraviolet.
11 Likes
The machines log the use. If for some reason the Doctor cared about the usage data they could get it.
That data is used to properly calibrate the machine to the personâs sleep apnea (pressure used - whether it is a fixed pressure or it auto titrates against the resistance of the airway). The logs also give numbers of hours of effective therapy (cannot remember of the top of my head the criteria for that) and there is also a number of hours per night of effective therapy that are considered a threshold for it to be treating the sleep apnea. For me most of that was done by a Respiratory Therapist who sent the results on to my specialist.
However the Specialistâs involvement was mainly - Determine if I might have sleep apnea, refer to the therapist for the machine, Determine the exact nature of my sleep issues (done out of order because of the length of time to book the full testing), Review results of full testing and info from Therapist ⌠and that was it. I have not seen her since. It is the respiratory therapist i see for yearly follow up and as mentioned by @PhasmaFelis make sure the fit is right.
4 Likes
No that would be hookers and barbiturates - blow is a stimulant and these people want to sleep
1 Like
Look, Iâm just going to start this by saying I also think itâs unfeasible, but I can answer some of your questions. Maybe thereâs some tech out there that youâre simply not aware of and will be happy to learn about. I enjoy this kind of thing, Iâm an instrumentation engineer.
Whereâs the data tracking for ongoing monitoring? How do they know itâs set up properly?
You could feasibly use an ASIC (application specific integrated circuit) to do all of the logging and communicate wirelessly or by some small cable connection.
How do they keep the sound down? Some of the current CPAP designsâ size is sound dampening.
It says they use massively parallel small pumps, so that would be how. Iâm not certain how that functions and this is the most infeasible part of it to me - I donât think they could get the kind of flow performance necessary to keep a human alive from a pump that small. But there are examples in nature of pumps that would work in parallel in the kind of beehive formation this appears to have. Imagine a thousand tiny intestines that were pumping air instead of⌠other stuff. There are a number of mechanical phenomena that would allow this kind of rolling contraction in small sizes, I have no idea how one would manufacture such a thing. Super precise 3d printing maybe, pneumatically actuated? Not sure. The energy use from doing that much work would surely exceed the power supply of a battery in that tiny form factor.
How do they generate enough air pressure for 8+ hours? Is it variable? If this was so âeasyâ, why does my CPAP require a 12v converter or a marine battery to run?
Your CPAP was not optimized for energy consumption. Thatâs pretty much it. There are small travel ones meant for airplanes that also will run for 8 hours without a marine battery. They claim some kind of pump innovation, but Iâm skeptical of this like you.
In-nose appliances cause severe irritation, which is why theyâre the last-resort.
Yeah, I had a little springy thing that held my nostrils open because my problem is more in the nasal cavity. It causes some minor inflammation and I donât like it. Breath-rite strips help a lot too, but similarly are irritating and come off in the middle of the night, tickle a bit and wake me.
What happens when you roll over and cover the intake with a pillow?
The same thing that happens when everyone rolls over and covers their air intake, they either roll back over or wake up gasping.
How do you get the water in it for humidity control?
I doubt that is necessary. Iâm guessing in a CPAP the air compression will cause water to fall out, and need to be re-dispersed as a fine mist or else it would leak everywhere or require regular emptying. In the nostrils the heat would probably keep any compressed water vapor gaseous.
Without a hose, how will it measure pressure accurately? (the system of motor-hose-mask-lungs creates the positive pressure system⌠otherwise youâre using negative pressure to fill the lungsâŚ)
This is the easiest to solve. There are MEMS (micro-electromechanical sensors) pressure sensors for this. A tiny hose projecting into the high pressure side (the nasal plugs) would easily grab the pressure. These types of sensors are in the <$10 range and ultra-low power already from mass manufacture in medical devices and vehicle tire pressure monitoring. Hereâs a PDF example of one component that would probably work here. http://www.st.com/st-web-ui/static/active/en/resource/technical/document/datasheet/DM00140895.pdf
EDIT:
Seems like from their mention of chip cooling tech that they may be referring to something like this for pumps. Tiny ion pump sets new standard in cooling hot computer microchips | UW News
2 Likes
I could have sworn that someone was developing something like this but not these people. Or maybe they are the same and a more complicated description was considered not suitable for fundraising. The video does use language that implies they are pumping rather that maintaining a higher pressure threshold in the airway. Also they seem to imply that the air in through these micro pumps is separate from the one out for exhaling. Not sure that would work for a pressure regulation.
I can see why people would want such a small device. But I wonder if you can really get a high enough flow rate through even a whole bunch of those tiny pumps. The resistance through one of them I imagine is enormous. In a cylindrical pipe, the pressure drop goes up as the fourth power of the radius, and thatâs with laminar flow. Throw in turbulence, and itâs even more. The tiny size of the ports does lower the Reynolds number and likelihood of turbulence, but they are rectangles, and the ports seem to be smaller that the rectangular pump chambers, so I can visualize energy-sucking vortices in the corners. (I realize the animation shown in the video may not be anything like the final design.) And are check valves needed somewhere to control things so it doesnât try to pressurize the whole bedroom?
Iâd like to see some CFD of this, to show that itâs even practical, with some analysis of the power required. I just canât believe that the power needed to increase the pressure by say 12 mmHg, all night long, can be provided by a tiny battery. However, even if it requires a cord to a wall wart, a typical wall wart power cord would be better than a hose.
And as someone else here has said (I think), how is the pressure controlled?
Yeah, I retracted my statement just as you were posting this. I found an ion-pumping article thatâs more likely what theyâre referring to. Itâs very likely they did a back-of-the-envelope calculation on the stated performance of that tech and havenât ever actually built anything that is proven to perform in this capacity.
The problem with a back-pressure regulator would be that pressure couldnât be maintained during inhalation. Your lungs would collapse the pressure, and thus, your airways while inhaling, despite any pressure regulation.
This may or may not have been the one i remembered:
âThe device consisted of a small valve inserted into each nostril calibrated to provide negligible inspiratory resistance, but increased expiratory resistance with a back pressure between 60 and 90 cm H2O*sec/Liter (at 100 mL/sec flow).â
However I thought i remembered one with more electronic regulation rather than a clever valve.
I can see these being fired across the room if you happen to sneeze.
The first hack for these will be a rechargeable battery.
2 Likes
I went through the whole rigamarole of getting tested and fitting for a CPAP and decided that I just wouldnât use it. It was incredibly stressful and often suffocating.
At the.moment I just use a nasal spray to open up my passages.
I get all of JoeBristowâs criticisms, but if this works at all, something half-good is better than nothing at all.
1 Like
I canât even begin to tell folks how many times I wake up through the night because of my 'effing CPAP machine. Like, how often do people wake up because of air blowing on your lacrimal caruncle? Freaking weird-assed sensation to wake up to. On top of that is the typical sound of air escaping around the sides whenever I happen to roll over in my sleep or the mask gets slightly pressed to one side. I hate (and I rarely use that word towards anything) my machine.
Sure would simplify cosplay.
Go get a different mask. Tell them you toss and turn a lot.
Seriously, I donât have particularly bad apnea, but partially waking up 16 times an hour was not getting me the sleep I need.
Iâm on my third mask. Most of my problems stem from the fact that Iâm a stomach sleeper (because of the apnea, probably) and my gigantic head (7 7/8ths hat size). Nothing is really made with my forehead circumference in mind.
2 Likes
this seems like a total scam to me.
iâd really like to think that âmassively parallelâ âmicro-pumpsâ could deliver enough air pressure through such small channels and last 8 hours on an internal battery, but it just doesnât seem possible. These pumps would have to be several orders of magnitude more efficient and higher volume than anything iâve ever heard of. micro bellows just arenât going to deliver on this level.
their rewards seem fishy, they never deliver any product to backers. what you get are email newsletters (aka spam, probably asking for more money) and coupons for a product that you very likely might never be able to get your hands on because it is vaporware.
3 Likes
Hmm⌠7 1/2 hat size here. Maybe time for my third mask, too?
Thanks for the suggestion!
Their FAQ page says they use electrostatic actuators to move the micro-blowersâŚ
Iâm wondering if they are forming a sort of fluid diode. Add a little resistance to exhaling but not inhaling to increase the overall internal pressure? Basically use the lungs to move the air, which otherwise would require a lot of power, but use just a little bit of power to modulate it.
1 Like
Doesnât work because when the lungs expand, it sucks air in (creates negative pressure), which collapses the soft tissue. Thatâs why the system needs to stay at a positive pressure, so that the airway stays open even when the pressure drops.
1 Like
Yeah, you definitely need a different mask. Might also help to tighten the straps a bit. If youâve got air coming out the sides, itâs not fitting properlyâit should form a seal.
My favorite mask has thick, soft gel padding on the contact surfacesâI think ComfortGel is the brand name. It makes it much easier to tighten the straps enough for a good seal without causing irritation.
Some people find it helps to loop the slack of the hose over the bedpost or a wall hook or something. May keep the weight of it from pulling your mask sideways.
(Oh, my hat size is 7 3/4, also. My enormous brain is both a blessing and a curse.)
1 Like
EVEN IF the device can provide enough pressure and run for the 8 hours on the batteryâŚ
why the HELL is it a consumable device? It makes no sense whatsoever. Itâs inefficient, and I would NEVER EVER choose a device that would require throwing 365 of these things into a landfill every year.
The decision to make a consumable is disgusting.
1 Like
