How many people do you personally count as friends or family who voted for Trump?
If the answer is none, you are getting your entire understanding of them from other Trump opponents and from the media.
If the answer is (at least) a few, I apologize for the implications of the above.
2008 McCain 60.0m : Obama 69.5m
2012 Romney 61.0m (+1.0) : Obama 66.0m (-3.5)
2016 Trump 59.5m (-1.5) : Clinton 60.0m (-6.0)
Says it all, really.
Really does!!
A number. I wouldn’t have said it otherwise you smug asshole.
So, are they all racists?
Your differential for Trump seems incorrect. Based upon your numbers (which I have not verified), I believe that should be -1.5, not -0.5.
Absolutely. I don’t give a shit what excuse you use, but voting for Trump for personal gain was an openly racist decision. As much as those people have legitimate gripes with the American system they chose the racist vote, and they need to accept that.
One of them openly bragged about him and some other republican voters telling a Hispanic woman who was asking if this was a polling location that she was in the wrong country let alone the wrong place.
My parents have mysteriously begun mentioning black people negatively for the first time about 4-5 years ago and the first thing my dad said negatively about any political figure in my entire life was to complain about Hillary.
A new coworker and I talked about how I don’t know if I can find reliable child care if the GOP decides is the DREAM act is worth pursuing before she can renew her papers, and he never even considered how it could impact someone like me.
Anyone defending the open racism shown in this country, especially in the states I on this forum have been saying are extremely racist areas from personally experience, are just trying to cover it up. Trump supporters are racist. We are in a political era where minority specific issues will be put on the back burner or go backwards again.
Corrected, tnx. Numbers from Wikipedia, rounded to closest 0.5.
Ok, fair enough. I apologize for assuming you were living in the echo chamber.
And then people organize. And then the aforementioned corrupt constabulary organizes. You have the two groups looking at one another. Then the cops pull out their guns, and we’re back to where we started.
That’s actually an interesting point. On paper, Obama sorta looks good, aside from a few bits of barbed wire poking through.
And yet, people were dissatisfied enough to vote for drumpf.
It’s interesting to note that GWB/Kerry was on similar levels (62/59), whereas GWB/Gore was much lower (50/51) and Clinton further down (47/39 in '96, 44/39 in '92, but tbf he had Perot taking 8m and 20m). Would be interesting to graph voters vs population numbers, to see if the growth (100m to 120/130m) matches that or is a symptom of increased partecipation.
Or rather, dissatisfied enough to not vote for the continuity candidate. Republican numbers are pretty flat, the swings seem to be mostly a function of Dem voters dropping out.
[quote=“Nobby_Stiles, post:917, topic:89005, full:true”]
Something tells me I wrote something you disagree with. However I can’t tell what it is from what you wrote. [/quote]
The problem is that you’re using an imprecise term like “unfettered immigration,” the kind of language that brain-dead nativists use to imply that Dem politicians support throwing the borders open with absolutely no controls. Perhaps try to be a little more precise in your terminology.
Yes, thats how I read it. Seems like a combination of Millenials (3rd party?) and Afro-Americans (black card is not fully transferable or perhaps some of the “super-predator” mud stuck.
That combined with rural America hating her enough to bring out never before voters. I dont get it but she definitely was a peculiarly polarizing candidate for the Dems to choose.
No. It’s just that open racists were more likely to vote for him. And apparently that translates to a lot of open racists still out there in America.
I think that was the kind of language Trump supporters used. Whether it was true or not. And I dont think that is the problem.
I think that the adverse comment was based on the idea that I might share Trump voters views regarding what is an appropriate immigration policy. But I spoke on what was in the interests of the white working class. I am neither white nor working class but I am pretty damn sure that unrestricted low skilled immigration is not in their interests. It reduces wages for low wage workers that compete with the white working class for jobs. Which is sort of confirmed by the low wage jobs in coastal urban areas being mainly done by immigrants, afro Americans or their kids.
I think its just intellectually dishonest to try and pretend low-skill immigration is not going to suppress wages for low skilled jobs. If you hire low skill labor it is clearly in your interests to encourage more immigration. Or if you own real estate or the means of production - either directly or indirectly.
Thought experiment for you. If you find a black or hispanic Trump supporter, would you consider them a racist?
Yep. To paraphrase Sir Pratchett, just because someone is an ethnic minority does not mean that they cannot also be a complete and utter dick. If they voted for the racist candidate using the one piece of institutional power that they possessed, then they are morally and ethically culpable for the results of their choice.
I never suggested there be a tolerance of bigotry, and that would completely be the wrong way to go. There needs to be solidarity, understanding, and respect for shared values, and a recognition that these people matter.
There needs to be actual solutions offered to them, they need a seat at the table.
So yeah, I agree with you, the failure of the Democratic party is that they serve very specific masters, and unless you’re a member of their elite supporter base, you’re going to be left in the cold, and leaving those people in the cold, abandoning them, or in the case of this election actively driving them off, is not just a losing strategy but a fundamentally immoral one.
The Democrats, the Clintons in particular, helped kill the unions in the 90s, and that’s pretty much all they’ve done for the working class that I can remember. And when you talk to them about it and ask what they will do to help, they always list policies firmly aimed at helping urban and suburban peoples. It’s like they’re blind.
And yeah, Bernie seemed genuinely interested in helping these people. I think if he had won the primary, he would have won the general with their support.
