They are doing it together! Putin and Trump, BFFs for LIFE!
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Rasmussen says itās 223%. Whoās the fake news now?!
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These are communist human rights violations. Based on our willingness to try to avoid them by substituting fascist and/or theocratic human rights violations; those are at least 350% more pernicious; because reasons.
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Unless it came from Faux News, itās not real news!!
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In all seriousness I donāt get this either except as an excuse to roll back Obama policy out of spite, to gloat that he kept a campaign promise, and to satisfy a small but vocal hyper-conservative group of supporters in an important state.
We prop up plenty of military dictatorships so I donāt buy the human rights, military, or āCuban peopleā argument. Cuba hasnāt been a threat to us since Kennedy was in office. Weāre literally the only country in the world with these restrictions against Cuba so all weāre doing is effectively missing out on billions of dollars in potential trade.
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Yeah but Putin has just a bit more practice.
After all, not everything is about POTUS Trump.
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I mean, he was a KGB dude, after all. But then again, we can also see how in the last few years of the Obama presidency, he was actively attempting to shift concerns from the war on terror to more existential concerns over a resurgent Russia (especially after the stuff in Ukraine). Clinton was clearly campaigning on that too.[quote=āIsrael_B, post:26, topic:102892ā]
not everything is about POTUS Trump.
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True. But heās the current president, and the executive has wide latitude in setting foreign policy, meaning what he does there matters and shapes world events. But on second thought, I think Iād say that at least at the outset, Trump sought to reapproach the Russians and forge better relations. That doesnāt seem to be working out, however, in part because of the ongoing probe by congress and the FBI, but also due to the fact that we have very different interests in the middle east (the Russians backing Assad, Iran, the Huthis, Hamas, etc and weāre buddy-buddy with the Saudis, UAE, Egypt, etc - I would say Israel, but I think in this case, the Israelis are only a marginal part of that equation). Part of the problem of Trump is that he seems to have no real coherent policy (or his policies are being drawn from a number of different places with competing interests in world affairs).
I dunnoā¦ I still am not sure if I think whatās happening is a new Cold War or something else entirely. I suspect itās only in retrospect that we have gotten any sort of real understanding of what the Cold War actually meant and how it shaped things in reality.
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trolley Bumps Back Obama Cuba Policy
As you sort of said though, he inherited the situation.[quote=āMindysan33, post:27, topic:102892ā]
I still am not sure if I think whatās happening is a new Cold War or something else entirely.
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Not new, just a continuation of what was paused for a bit. Call it 1.5 rather than 2.0.
Or, in this case, talking about undoing everything Obama did, without actually doing much.
Despite his strong rhetoric about ācompletely cancelling the entire one sided dealā and ārolling back the whole policyā and stuff, whatās this new policy do?
- It will āstrengthen the rhetoricā. oooh scary!
- They will āenforceā the existing rules about travel to Cuba.
- They will prohibit commerce with Cuban businesses that deal with the military or intelligence services.
- They will reiterate the US stance to the UN on human rights.
- They will not change anything about tourism, the embassy, or taking Cuban goods back to the US.
So, uh, nothing much of substance really changes. Trumpās just stomping his feet and acting tough.
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Not even Breitbart is in step in this one, though they did highlight it against Russiaās desires.
I think this just comes from the same old-cranky-man mindset that keeps the embargo in place. Thereās really zero reason to keep being a dick about Cuba, but no Republican wants to be the guy to lower the metaphorical guns pointed at a Communist state just offshore. It would look soft and weak. So yeah, letās keep punishing these people whoāre still driving cars from the 50s (because itās all they have) and whose lives would vastly improve if US goods were allowed in their country.
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True, but each president puts their own spin on foreign policy. Continuity matters, but course alterations tend to happen when you switch from one party to the other - this rolling back of Obamaās lighter touch with Cuba is a prime example. Also, I donāt think that the Saudis, Egyptians, and UAE would have blocked Qatar like they did without some sort of understanding or tacit approval by the US. Thatās been a slow burning issue for a while (especially given how antagonistic they are towards Al-Jazeeraās coverage of the war in Yemen). I do think that those small changes do matter and they should be paid attention to. But yes, continuity is also something we should note and understand.
Iām still not sure on that count. Weāre going to have to see, I think. The US and Russians having a big bad to point to certainly is a continuation of the past (even if there was a rather large gap in antagonism as the Soviet Union dissolved). But weāre talking about a more integrated economic situation, with competition happening pretty much within a more globalized economy rather than several economic systems butting up against each other. I think thatās not nothing to consider.
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The really weird thing about the continued support for the Cuba embargo is how contrary to the usual lines about the victory of the free market it is.
Sure, back when they were receiving shipments of Soviet ballistic missiles, there was a certain urgent argument in favor of breaking out the blockade; but not even the more hysterical commentators claim that Cuba is getting anything out of the ordinary; and basically all concede that with the US among the few still embargo-ing; Cuba can access enough more prosaic goods and services that we arenāt exactly going to starve them out.
A relatively poor(but not actively collapsing) planned economy within spitting distance of the US and easily served by low cost sea freight seems like something the free marketeers should be salivating over: If you canāt bury the commies in irresistible consumer goods and dissatisfaction with their sclerotic planned economy(and do well by doing good at the same time) under those circumstances, where can you?
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It was fairly dodgy even then.
Soviet missiles in Cuba were a response to American missiles in Turkey. If you donāt want weapons aimed at you, donāt aim them at other people.
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Zombie Regan still scares the shit out of me more than Zombie Castro ever could.
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Oh, I donāt mean to claim that we were the cruelly wronged innocents; just that as an exercise of ābecause we canā, it was at least arguably coherent and grounded in something one could describe as a national interest.
As with many ābecause we canā positions it didnāt earn top marks for fairness, solid grounds in abstract principles of justice, etc; but it was a coherent exercise of power to get what we wanted from someone with less power; rather than an incoherent exercise of power to get, um, something? from someone with less power.
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Absolutely, and they were, when Obama started relaxing trade and tourism restrictions. But the X factor here is the weird way the Cuban economy is structured; its tourism industry, especially its hotel business, is largely controlled and overseen by the military. All of the major luxury hotels are co-owned by the military and foreign investors. So I donāt think itās a mystery why Trump is specifically tightening rules on doing business with anything associated with the Cuban military; it impacts his hotel business.
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It could well be that that provides Trump with extra reasons for petulance; but it is worth noting that āeconomy substantially in the militaryās pocketā isnāt a general-purpose turn off.
In China, the PLA has a great many fingers in a great many pies(and is actually of some concern, notably unlike Cuba); and solid true-blue Freedom Buddies like Egypt and Pakistan also have rather outsize military involvement in the broader economy.
It may well be a reason: but mostly in a pretext-y sort of way.
