What would a new US civil war be like?

#29

lots of dead americans.

russia would be laughing, though

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#31

Maybe attitudes can move to further to the left?

Under no pretext should arms and ammunition be surrendered; any attempt to disarm the workers must be frustrated, by force if necessary.

Karl Marx, 1850

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#32

While Washington geographically is more conservative, it should be noted that the bulk of the population lives in the Puget Sound region, which is decidedly liberal. So, assuming this map represents a redistribution based on a second Civil War being fought - essentially to a stalemate? - it’s more likely the Upper Left-Hand Corner of WA would either become an enclave of the U.S., or perhaps we just get absorbed into the Province of British Columbia, which, frankly, wouldn’t be an unpopular outcome for us in this scenario.

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#33

Washington and Oregon would be divided into eastern and western halves, right along the mountains. They are already separate states in all but name.

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#34

That’s a poorly drawn map of the United States during the 1860s.

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#36

India has managed to not tear itself apart yet, and they have actual states which are communist next to states that are capitalist.

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#37

Beat me to it

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#38

I think the map would look more like this (electoral map from 2008 presidential election)

I honestly think that Utah and New Mexico would actually be blue to be completely honest. And everything from north of Colorado/Nebraska (Montana, Idaho, Wyoming, Dakotas) would be neutral and just stay out of it…It would probably take too long for those 12 people to come down from those states anyway.

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#40

There’s actually a pretty surprising concentration of neo Nazi and white supremacy religious living camps in the more remote parts of Idaho. I don’t think Idaho would be a neutral state. Plus, the stereotypes of racist Mormons in Utah? The Mormons in southern Idaho tend to actually live up to them.

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#41

The problem is that it isn’t regional, it’s urban vs. rural. For all of the complaints from the rural districts, the urban ones support them. Cut the rural ones loose on their own and you get third-world conditions. If the rural ones want to compel the urban ones to support them, they would have to occupy them – and the urban districts have most of the population and even more of the economy.

Our current system gives disproportionate influence (read: power) to the rural parts of the country. If we actually end up settling the rural tantrum, they’ll end up with less because the current setup was a bribe to keep them happy. Now they’re not happy with the size of the bribe.

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#42

thank you for highlighting which states I shouldn’t visit. Kansas?

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#43

No, we really don’t, though. Not en masse.

Millions of people marched against 45 and his hateful regime repeatedly, vs the thousands of broflake fucktards that rallied in the shitshow that was Charlottesville.

No matter how delusional the alt reich may be about ‘winning,’ they are outnumbered.

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#44

Well I think it’s overly simplified to say it’ll be a civil war like the first one we’ve experienced. I doubt the military command would defect to any other state this time around. Rather, I believe it would be a semi-organized group of mobs killing each other. Think the irregulars that participated in the last civil war in states like Kansas and Arkansas where random people with horses and guns would raid each other’s towns (usually killing non-combatants in the process like kids and women). That’s the kind of civil war that I can see happening. You might wonder then where the US armed forces would be in the mix? My guess they would try to break up the fight but after it became clear they couldn’t quell the violence they’d pull back to stronger positions and protect key assets like nuclear missile silos, naval bases, rail stations, and their larger army and air bases. The rest? They’d less us kill each other until we couldn’t put up much of a fight.

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#45

As a lifelong Northerner, whenever the conversation would turn to the Civil War I would joke to friends of the Southern persuasion, “Don’t make us come back down there again.”

I’ve lately stopped making that joke.

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#46

A civil war won’t divide up on neat state lines, it would be rural vs urban within each state. It doesn’t matter who has guns prior to the start, within a few weeks everyone will have guns. The immediate winners will be Mexican drug cartels, if the war goes on for a few years, an invasion by ‘peacekeeping’ armies from other countries can be expected.

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#47

This is not going to be a civil war fought with guns. As TFA points out, it’s headed for low-level unconventional warfare. That’s not fought with small arms. It’s fought with sabotage, bombs, software, poison, etc. at the individual level. If it comes to firefights, you’re looking at the people who have armored vehicles, aircraft, etc. getting involved and your deer rifle isn’t going to matter.

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#48

Also anecdotally, I’m a lefty in rural New York state. I could arm a small militia.

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#49

So the scenes from middle eastern nations we are used to see on tv could be replicated in America?

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#50

TWhich Civil War do you mean? Because if the Confederate States seceeded early in this century, it would be invading the US agaain by 2080. That is when the effects of climate change on their land area can no longer be denied, because they will be in such dire straits as a result.
They won’t be able to support their population on the food that they can produce. They won’t have trading partners such as Mexico or California, where most of our produce is grown. The Dead Zone in the Gulf of Mexico will have killed off vast areas of aquaculture. There will not be enough potable water to support large herds of cattle, or even factory farms of chicken and hogs. The New Confederates will want to emigrate to someplace where the average annual daily temperature isn’t 90C, or they will begin to suffer severely shortened life spans.

Then there is the financial firestorm that will lay waste to Confederate fortunes, starting with property values. Florida will be losing land mass due to sea level rises, and there will not be anymore Federal Floor Insurance to cover those losses so property prices will plummet. Foreign investment that has been propping up so many Gold Coast communities will flee, since even autocrats will not invest in sinking condominiums that can’t get insurance. Agricultural land will become worthless as it becomes unable to support crops. The Confederate States really upon military spending to prop up many of its localized econmies; without the taxes provided by the Blue States, they won’t be able to afford to maintain such large bases and standing guard services. Low graduation rates and a scepticism of non-religious education will discourage foreign employers from setting up shop in the South. Silcon Valley and the 124 Corridor in Boston will thrive, as tech business flee the North Carolina Tech Corridor.

And if the marchers this past weekend get their wish of a white ethnostate, they will be losing most of the lower-paid labor that they rely for non-skilled labor. This is, of course, presuming that they wouldn’t attempt to reinstitute slavery or an apartheid system that prevents movement for members of certain racial categories.

It is obvious that a new Civil War will reduce most of America from a superpower to a bywater. The United States may be able to participate as an important and thriving member of a global economy, since it would still be a powerhouse in earnings, would contain two of the primary market capitals of the world, the New York Stock Exchange and the Chicago Mercantile Exchange. The USA will contain the great majority of the United States’ best research institutions.

One caveat to that map above: Maryland may choose to be a Blue State, rather than a border state. It is home to many of those employed in DC, and that won’t be changing soon. The situation with Virginia is more problematis, since Northern Virginia is quite blue. If a vote to secede is done on the basis of a state-wide vote, it might become the Border State instead.

Would the Confederacy be content with becoming just “another Mexico” to the geographically smaller United States? Well, at least they will have their belief in God’s support of their righteous cause to sustain them. After all, the Old Testament Prophets and the Israelites lived the desert. Florida may need to start working on that Ark, though.

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#51

Just like the civil war in Colombia?

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