The chart is a bit misleading, because the number of cases is not divided by population, but I agree that both Iceland and Norway did a really good job.
Point of wearing masks outside is that people who do not wear masks are easy to spot by police patrols. If there was a policy of wearing masks only in stores and public transport, enforcement would fall on store workers, and could lead to aggression when they point out the rules (I hear this happens in USA, sometimes with tragic results). Another point is that people are not so eager to socialize outside due to masks.
Due to mandatory mask wearing policy here in Poland nearly every store sells these. In a neigbouring town police officers were recently giving out masks sewn by volunteers.
Thanks to you two keeping a clear head here in relation to the logical fails presented and the exaggerated headline. It seems like some people here did not watch the video, nor keep up with the finer details. FYI, Sweden has an R0 rate of less than 1 now.
There are countries that have very high death per capita numbers. Some are in the lockdown group, some are in the laissez faire group. There still is no vaccine coming for the next 12-18 months, so that leaves the question “when do the locked down nations open up society again”? For some of you guys, especially if you live among armed maniacs in a medical-care-for-the-rich-only society, opening up early could be a major mistake. Do not assume that your situation is the same as everybody else’s though. Please check back in a couple of weeks, and let’s see how similar to Sweden your nation will be behaving then.
Hawaii has a 14 day quarantine for anyone who flies in; that has pretty effectively killed tourism (which is most of the economy).
It is pretty hard to enforce these policies in a free democracy. The Norwegian police admitted early on that there was nothing they could do to break up groups >5 other than be stern with the group. Things like curfews and total lockdowns are easier than mild lockdowns with extra added technical conditions; these rely on social responsibility and stigma for violators.
Why should it be? Just as there are laws mandating wearing seatbelts, or not driving a car with more people than it’s rated capacity, laws making mask wearing mandatory or limiting size of gatherings may be enacted in accordance with democratic procedures. Even constitution can be amended if there’s a need to do so (but it has to be done with great care).
They could give them a fine, if proper law was introduced.
don’t worry, USA is going to take that prize back from Sweden
meanwhile Mark Cuban has become my new favorite billionaire, frack Elon and Bezos, check out what he did, “secret shoppers” to check out what reopening is actually like, surprising absolutely no-one turns out rules are for fools
In Sweden there is no laws that allow general curfews in peacetime. The limit disallowing gatherings of 50 or more people are based on the law for preventing dangerous communicable diseases and would as I understand it be prosecuted as a crime against public order so the penalities are pretty mild (fines mostly, maybe up to six months in prison if someone is doing something dangerous) even if the police could resort to force if absolutely necessary.
One thing that most foreigners do not understand about the Swedish system of governance is the independence of the authorities in Sweden towards politicians. Wikipedias article on ministerstyre explains it quite well.
I think the Norwegians feel that their laws are “proper”.
Years ago, after I was arrested at a demonstration for “loitering in the roadway”, a friend of mine who was a law school professor described this kind of law as a hallmark of a police state. (My sister who was a federal prosecutor, disagreed when I mentioned this…)
W/r to seat belt laws, I am not a lawyer, but I understand that when they have been challenged in the courts in various states they were upheld because of the overwhelming evidence that such laws prevent significant health and economic damage not only to the wearer but also to others and t society as a whole. This evidence for mask wearing (and even for outdoor social isolating) does not yet exist.
I think that is true in Norway as well, but the legislature here granted the PM special temporary powers. There was a time limit (1 month, since extended) and also an interesting codicil that they could be revoked if a large minority (33% I think) of the legislature wanted them revoked.
Are you sure that the words “Stop resisting!” won’t be yelled at anyone with dark skin pigmentation that refuses to tip the mask soon enough and in submissive enough way?
Like Hawaii, Alaska has a mandatory two week quarantine on entry from out of state. Now enforcement is likely less strict in AK versus Hawaii, but yes, need to balance the food and stuff supply chain otherwise.
Going to be an unusual summer in Alaska (and everywhere, absolutely, but another ~60N deg latitude perspective) - no shock, but most of the Alaskan cruises are cancelled for the season. Alaska primarily derives its revenue from resource extraction (oil, minerals, fish) and tourism. Our state budget was a mess before. Will be an even bigger mess now.
Rally together… while practising appropriate distancing. Hopefully the Swedes have not been Balkanized by the rich like the USA has; where partisan politics seems to be driving the country deeper and deeper in to the mire.
Unsure about the handwashing stations. The social distancing is working great though. Hardly anyone uses local transport. Google traffic data shows a massive reduction in movement. Bus drivers are not accepting payment anymore and are far removed from passengers. People work from home and most of the streets (ignore the TV “news” that love to show people sitting around in restaurants) look like they have been hit by the neutron bomb. Mind you, this is how the affluent average Swede lives. If your job is a menial one you’ll still be in vicinity of others while conducting your daily affairs. Any social living for old people and sick people is NOW in complete quarantine. A bit too little and too late, considering that is where 30-50% of the deaths have taken place. Late stage capitalism issue.
The nursery schools and 1st to 9th grade of proper school have been kept open. The motivation for that is that essential workers can not go to their essential jobs if their kids have nowhere to go. Now it seems like Sweden did not need the essential medical workers in quite the same range as was modelled. The ICUs are not full and the hospitals are not buckling under the weight.
Contact tracing is basically non-existent. No need for that when the virus is close to everywhere. For a nation above a certain level of infection, it is about as useless as spraying chlorine in the streets. IE window dressing, lipstick on a pig to benefit politicians.
That is the opposite of the purpose of contact tracing. Contact tracing is most needed when there is a relatively small percentage of population infected diffused over a large area.
