Check your privilege, dude.
5 Likes
I disagree, but I can see where youâre coming from.
Got any response to my charge of tabloidish exaggeration? Donât you think this discussion wouldâve gone better minus your tone of hysteria? Not so many comments would have ensued though, amirite?
1 Like
Please expand on that cryptic imperative; Iâm genuinely curious how you draw that bow.
Maybe you need to click that link to the definition of nuance I posted above.
1 Like
Is this the same site that used to run ads for the Suicide Girls porn-site? I know Iâve read pro pron posts here. Whatâs the disconnect?
Are you going to tell us the âladiesâ on the SG website wearing school uniforms and pigtails with no hair down there arenât contributing to the sexualization of minors?
8 Likes
What I canât figure out is why you would protest the sexism of the picture by saying it was appealing only for âold men to wank to.â Really? You want to fight sexism with ageism? You donât look so young yourself, sonny.
Have a nice day.
6 Likes
[Grabs crotch]. Yeah, still there.
1 Like
We canât do both for some reason?
2 Likes
I briefly mentioned it earlier, but I suspect that itâs not the focus of discussion because thereâs nothing to talk about it. Everyone agrees that itâs fucked up. Itâs not okay in âgeek cultureâ â whatever that is â but itâs unavoidable that when you give billions of anonymous strangers an unmoderated forum, some of them are going to use it to spew misogyny, racism, etc., particularly when the subject is something that makes them insecure and defensive.
1 Like
Iâm amazed by the number of niggling hair-splitting half-points commenters have managed to drag up to justify what is just so obviously sexist bullshit.
But they arenât technically actually the size of her head! Seriously?
But it can be argued that she is not half-dressed! Are you kidding me?
But thatâs how the genre works! So thatâs okay then?
But porn stars! WTF?
But I did not/do not personally masturbate to comic book characters! So?
But men are also unrealistically drawn! You seriously donât see a difference?
But âold men to wank toâ is ageism! What in the hell are you talking about?
That people would make these arguments in public with (presumably, mostly) a straight face says something dispiriting about comic book culture. Look at the goddamn cover art.
29 Likes
From what I can tell she inherited her momâs boobs and waist.
1 Like
No they donât. This is a constant, pernicious, and oftentimes well organized group effort by guys that have gotten together under the same banner. They are reactionaries, actively fighting feminism and egalitarianism.
Treating this as just some random trollies taking advantage of anonymity is wrong.
20 Likes
Oh fun! Let me try:
Headlines need have no basis in fact! For real?
Grossly exaggerating the object of a critique is okay if youâre trying to make a point! Since when?
Hm, that wasnât as fun as Iâd hoped.
There are three dozen better examples of sexist objectification on comics covers any given week if thatâs the point being made. True, âbut it could have been even worse!â is not a good argument, but mischaracterizing the very thing weâre looking at is pretty shoddy criticism/journalism.
âLook at them! Theyâre each the size of her head!â
âUh, no theyâre not.â
âStop nitpicking!â
5 Likes
Can we have a conversation rather than merely accusing others of being âobviouslyâ wrong? This isnât a black and white issue. Attractive women actually do exist, as do large, gravity defying boobs, especially with the help of modern support garments, which, presumably, superheros have access to.
In a post criticizing the exaggerated femininity of a comic book character Rob chose to use an exaggerated headline. So, yes, the headline is a legitimate issue to bring up. Rob set the tone for the thread himself.
The cover is not inherently sexist - I say that because sexism is contextual. If this comic was an outlier, nobody would care. The issue I think most people object to is that the hyper-feminity of female comic book characters is the rule rather than the exception.
Iâm going to say that yes, hyper-masculinity is a valid equivalent to bring up as a point of correspondence to hyper-femininity. What is the difference? Again, context, not realism. Neither is realistic, though there are both men and women who are close to some of the exaggerated comic book styles. Why is it wrong to exaggerate femininity and not masculinity? I think there is a perception that exaggeration of femininity is exploitation, that the sexuality makes the women weak, objects, victims and leads to body shaming. Whether that is true or not will depend in part on the story. To a certain degree it is just as presumptuous to say that female characters canât be empowered and hyper feminized in appearance, as when there was an outcry of offense over photos of an engineer people thought was âtoo pretty,â which was the same as saying that women canât be attractive and an engineer.
I do see that the hyper-feminization of the character on the Teen Titansâ cover is a choice I think is over the top. I really enjoyed Brave for making a heroine who was more realistic. However, I think we can have a conversation on this issue without all the rhetoric that is meant to be dismissive rather than engaging. I think the âshut people downâ phrase âcheck your privilegeâ should be auto censored.
What we should really be talking about is the un acceptable treatment Janelle Asselin got. That is related to the cover, but of more significance in my book.
6 Likes
Nope. Thatâs the point of the daily beast article: the culture does change, but it requires people to speak up and make a difference. Doing exactly this (and being organized about it), has been going on long enough for historical analysis of how the shift came/is coming/could come about in various geek conventions.
The world can change, including the bullshit sexist parts of the world.
3 Likes
Comic art has always been fantasy and that shows up in the physiques of the men and women depicted throughout, generally. Cute image at bottom of postâŚ
Sexuality has been seen as âevilâ and âdamagingâ and âdangerous,â especially to children throughout puritan culture, which is still pervasive in the United States, and as a result, people in the US are both obsessed with breasts, and freak the fuck out whenever anything about breasts comes up⌠and remember, any press is good press. Really, breasts arenât evil or bad or damaging, nor should they be hacked on to have dangerous materials installed for aesthetics, but this is the culture in which westerners, especially USians live. Businesses exploit this, because money.
Overly photoshopped and made-up female models occupy the cover issues of everything from technology magazines to mensâ magazines to womensâ magazines to teen womensâ magazines. Maybe because underneath all the bullshit, people are by and large drawn to the depiction of attractive young women⌠even if the photoshopping or drawing isnât anatomically accurate⌠theyâre looking for those good-for-breeding cues: pretty hair, big perky breasts, and a noticeable hip-to-waist ratio. The puritanism thing is taught, but these basics are biological. And businesses shall exploit that, because money.
Anyway, we have a culture that treats sex as damaging to women, enriching to men, and abhorent to anyone a day under their 18th year of age, and thatâs a recipe for fucked up gender relations and fucked up adults who have problems with sex and body image. Itâs sad. These attitudes go hand in hand with the attitude that a womanâs worth is in her sexuality and nowhere else. Thatâs sick and fucked up, and treating sexualization of a human body as the culprit is to fire at the wrong target and perpetuate the inequality. Be healthy, enjoy having a functioning body, and enjoy artwork that exaggerates sexy bodies beyond functional reality, because itâs art, or maybe a business trying to get you to buy something⌠whatever, the enemy is not the other gender, and the enemy is not those who enjoy the sight of the other gender. The enemies are those who tell you what you must feel, according to your gender, and those that try to divide you, by gender.
15 Likes
Are you actually, summarily dismissing the various counter-points and counter-arguments on this thread by saying that they (the counter-pointers and counter-arguers) are all in it together? And that they are engaged in a planned and organized policy? As Iâve asked of others on this site and on other threads under similar inscrutable circumstances, I hope youâre being sarcastic, ironic, or something. But I canât tell for sure.
Reactionary? Well organized?
Really? Really really?
Okay, my first two sentences should have been in their own paragraph. Let me amend for clarity: Everyone here agrees itâs fucked up.
(As to random trolls vs. organized effort, I really couldnât say. Are guys getting together in He Man Woman Haters Klubs to discuss strategy? Yeah, probably, in PUA gatherings and on MRA boards. I doubt theyâre divvying up whoâs going to call an author which names and whoâs going to make the rape threats and whoâs going to tell her to go get him a sammich though. I suspect thatâs the random trolls flocking together, but I have no evidence either way.)
1 Like
And He-Man was for kids, too. He was also a bit of a moron - letting Skeletor go at the end of every episode.
2 Likes
And Skeletor! What kind of pecs and abs and thighs should a half rotting corpse / skeleton dude have, biologically speaking? Certainly not the overtly sexy physique he sported in every episode and toy minting, thatâs for sure. Harrrrrumph! 
2 Likes
Theyâre not JUST inflated and spilling out of a skin-tight uniform on a âstrong female role model.â
Theyâre also IN THE DEAD CENTER OF THE SCENE. Theyâre in the very center of the three-dimensional gathering of heroes, and also in the dead center of the two-dimensional page.
Raise your hand if you think thatâs sheer coincidence.
Bonus points: âStrong female role modelâ also appears to be half-bound in some type of rope.
8 Likes
