Not conservative at all, right wing. Outside the US right wing can mean exclusively right wing economics. He was anti socialism as far as I knew , allied with libertarian views that makes him hard right wing in my book.
ETA
At the time of that pro choice rally Trump was vocally pro-choice…
Fair enough. Since we were talking about American politics, I was considering it from that context.
Also, I’d point out that in modern Europe hard right wing does now include being anti-choice if you consider Ireland and Eastern Europe.
But why assume that? It seems he had a pretty strong mind about things, and was not likely to just change his views at a whim. His libertarianism was certainly informed by 60s countercultural anti-establishment and anti-government views, but he was also pro-business as he was a small business owner, which would certainly align him more with the right than the left. That is at the heart of traditional libertarianism (think Goldwater), which the modern GOP has adopted as part of their platform. They’ve also adopted extreme religious views, and a great deal of hateful politics too. But deregulation is still a major part of their platform (although more for large corporations rather than small businesses).
And that definition is historically new in American politics too, I’d argue. Post-Reagan.
I didn’t assume it. 
I said I’d like to think that, and then listed reasons why that might not have been what happened and I could have been wrong.
Zappa seemed like a stubborn person who always thought he was correct and rarely changed his opinion on things.
Sure. But also Trump doesn’t really have beliefs or positions. Just what will give him the most power, attention and/or money from marks.
There are other examples from Zappa’s period that had similar stances and ended up going conservative of course. So yes, in the larger sense I do agree Zappa could well have ended up going the same contrarian route to de facto full conservatism if he had lived up to today. I just don’t see it as a certainty.
Very fair, and agree. That is the kind of fixed outlook that can make a person’s forward growth difficult, and could well have ended up with his regression into a Paul Rand type. Or worse.
No. The most right wing mainstream party in Ireland is pro choice and has never been hard anti choice. But there’s weirdness around it and honestly it wouldn’t be illuminating to discuss those. Poland having the right wing be anti choice can partially be seen as a reaction to Catholicism not being entirely approved of under communism but tolerated and allying itself with dissent, and the right wing.
All politics is local but as the article I read on here earlier today defined (right wing) libertarianism in terms of a quote from Edmund Burke - the arch liberal who hated the French Revolution because they killed toffs but loved the American because white supremacy, slavery, and imperialism (sorry free trade and liberty or something) - I think the term left as referring to redistributive and right to accumulative economics has distinct relevance and is why someone like Peter Thiel for example never has common cause with me.
ETA
Here’s the far right Irish news rag, the liberal, I mention it to remind us that the far right loves to champion privileged speech as free speech while suppressing progressive speech. In this case they are disgusted at police removing protestors interrupting the court and refusing to abide by its rulings. I include it because they also are, hilariously, unsure of what pronouns to use for this bigoted transphobic family.
I think the best way to characterize his political beliefs was “libertarian, but before the libertarians threw in their lot with the far right.” His positions didn’t align especially closely to either major political party, but most of the major gripes he had with the Democrats were related to things like censorship of the music industry (remember, this was the era when Tipper Gore was the face of “we must enact new regulations to protect children from exposure to obscene content!”). Even so, he still said he was a registered Democrat during a 1991 interview a couple years before his death.
We can’t know for sure how Zappa’s politics would have evolved if he lived long enough to see the Trump era but describing him as “hard right” definitely doesn’t sound accurate.
You know, I found a few Zappa-themed coke references but I don’t think most of them were referring to the beverage.
Dude, that’s two misses in a row.
As in ‘jinx, you owe Mindy a coke’, not Zappa did a lot of coke.
I humbly beg forgiveness, I was trying to find a clever spin on “I owe Mindy a coke” and clearly failed.
Too bad ‘reactions’ still don’t convey tone or body language; 'twould make misunderstandings more avoidable…
Also, and I’m sorry to be banging on here but I’m not sure it’s been explicitly referenced that his pro-choice does not necessarily align him with feminism. His progressive politics such as they were don’t seem to have been explicitly feminist to me. Like it was free love as consequence free sex for men. Now that wouldn’t have been in any way out of line with his generation but he did live long enough to set that record straight.
And as for being an asshole in this instance: he talent scouted a player and gave them a one year contract. A couple of weeks before it ends they are talent scouted by someone bigger. As it happens this gives them the opportunity to move on to a legendarily creative period. What do you say? I say “wow, you’ll be hiring me in five years. I hope.” Safe in the knowledge I haven’t been an asshole. Like if you really want to keep them and you can’t compete with the money what can you offer? This is your learning year, next year you’ll be even better/write with me/ whatever you have to offer them if you mean it.
Then please trust that the above apology was genuine and not intended as sarcasm.
No worries, mate
Feminist men tend to be more involved in child-rearing and he seemed not very involved at all…
To be fair on him as a father his children are complimentary, he just wasn’t around as his job was touring. I’m just basing that on Moon Zappa’s video that was on here a couple of years agos
The story behind “Valley Girl” is a kind of sweet anecdote about Frank finding way to spend more time with then-14-year-old Moon by doing a project together. Probably not the best dad around but far from the worst.
