Gentleman regrets touching elephant's trunk

never%20without%20my%20permission

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The monkey he got drunk
And touched the elephant’s trunk
The elephant swung
and he feel on his bung
And that’s what became of the monk

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You don’t tug on Superman’s cape.
You don’t spit into the wind.
You don’t pull the mask off the Lone Ranger.
And you don’t mess around with Jim… the elephant.

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Ok, bro is kinda dumb for trying to feed a wild animal and also trying to pet it. At the same time, the guy didn’t seem like an asshole to the elephant. Elephant was kind of an asshole (though well within its rights to be an asshole). I say give the bro a break, give the animal a break. Everyone goes home a little bit smarter for the experience. No harm, no foul.

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Elephant was super chill. Many elephants would have trampled him for less.

Isn’t the modern idea that we need there to be gender stereotypes so we can tell what it means to be a boy or a girl?

Because traditional gender roles may have ingrained in me that men in America don’t use the word adorable or fawn over cute things

The world is far from perfect so why should I pretend to be? Doesn’t really matter I don’t follow anyone’s norms I make my own. Besides it’s fucking cute. I want a baby elephant now I feel like it would understand me better than the political party that uses it as a mascot

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Thanks! I truly needed that.

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Do you really care? How about treat all people like human beings, worthy of respect, whatever their gender? Is it that hard to do?

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Sounds good to me. Not sure what the two things have to do with each other, though.

You seem to think that being a “boy” or a “girl” matters, and that you need to know which is which? That’s what I understood from your comment, so feel free to correct me, if I’m off base with your response to @milliefink.

Personally, I’m not sure it matters, if we’re all meant to be just people of equal standing, with the same access to the same rights, no matter our gender, race, or orientation. The categories that define masculine or feminine are just means of controlling us and making us compliant to systems of power that stop us from reaching our full potential, whatever is between our legs.

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I think I’m just trying to understand how things work. Milliefink’s comment sounds like the old idea that we should get away from gender stereotypes, but isn’t the new notion (which seems to have a lot of currency at BB) that gender is pretty much only stereotypes? Correct me if I’m wrong, it’s just an intriguing (apparent) contradiction.

PS - Totally agree with RandomDude. Cutest thing ever.

I’m a guy AND I found it adorable.

That’s a simplification of the idea that gender is performative and a social construct, I’d say. That doesn’t mean it’s not real and a powerful force in our lives, just that it’s largely socially constructed. But that does mean that women and men who don’t conform to those stereotypes set up by more powerful forces are punished for not conforming. Gender stereotypes are a new historical concept, but the idea of gender defining our roles in society is not new. Ideally, it would be nice if gender had no bearing on how our lives unfold, but it’s not the case. Masculinity is still more prized than femininity, and traits associated with the latter (especially when seen in men) are going to be attack in various ways as less then. Ideally, I think that people, no matter their gender, sexual orientation, etc, should be allowed to be whoever they feel comfortable being, and there should literally be no consequences for that.

As for the elephant, only an idiot would not find that cute!

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Thanks Mindysan. I’ll have to think about it a bit more.

Check out Foucault and Butler. Pains in the ass to read, but worth it if you wish to understand gender, sexuality, and power in the modern period.

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Thanks, I’ve listened to a bit of Butler a while ago and read a little Foucault (much longer ago). But do these things stay in my brain? No they do not.
In the meantime, I’ve read through your last comment and I’m still not sure why @RandomDude’s original comment was wrong. Being less emotional is surely a standard element in how our society constructs maleness, wouldn’t you agree?
Let me stress that this isn’t (even for a second) to say people should be penalised for expressing themselves however they want, or that we should have to conform to what society tells us we should be. I’m just saying that, if maleness has a definite socially defined form, we can’t blame someone for saying something like “although I’m a guy…”
On the other hand, if “guy” is a reference to (biological) sexual identity … maybe that resolves the two views. In that case, I guess, we can protest against sexual stereotypes AND affirm that gender is a sterotype.

It maybe, but is that any reason to accept it? That’s my point, that accept those stereotypes hurts people who don’t conform. People kill themselves over that shit.

I can’t speak for @milliefink, but @RandomDude’s comment seem to accept that being a man means that he can’t find a baby elephant adorable, that he should inherently be constrained and have to apologize for deviating for the norm. It would be nice if we could just say “that’s freaking adorable” and not have to worry about apologizing or hedging for that.

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Won’t someone think of the bros? /s

The whole world isn’t there for human’s edification.

Absolutely – and bonus points for “freaking” :slight_smile: (though I’m not sure if RD was expressing discomfort – maybe he was).
Not everyone would share your negative view of these sterotypes, though, would they? Surely a lot of trans (and CIS) people want to be male or female according to the traditional markers?