VPL reduction with boob support. /solved
At the end of the day, the kid is dead - thatâs the thing here. Read that one more time, the kid is DEAD, not hurt, not banged up, he doesnât have a black eye --heâs just dead and gone. His parents lost their son. How about at least spell his name correct or at the very least, spell it wrong consistently. Itâs Trayvon Martin. He was a human being who is because of Zimmermanâs actions. Yes, Zimmerman is too, but heâs alive and kind of acting like a dick in public after having shot a kid to death.
Also, are you telling me, if Martin did react to Zimmerman and go on the offensive, you wouldnât do the same thing if a strange man was following you around at night? Martin is not on trial here, heâs the one who died. Please keep that in mind.
Also, a law can be on the books, and be morally wrong. We have a long history of laws that most of us would agree are morally incorrect. Just because the jury found Zimmerman not guilty under the law, doesnât mean he was morally justified in his actions, no matter what happened between the two of them.
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Loony leftie bleeding heart liberal PC crowd = People that arenât completely selfish.
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Regardless of the guilt question, the copyright issue, and whether this constitutes profiting from oneâs misdeeds, Xeniâs message makes me sick to the stomach to read. I wouldnât address such a question to anyone. If I donât like them, I prefer not to communicate with them at all. But I acknowledge Iâm more sensitive than most.
If anyone else feels that saying ugly things to people who have done ugly things makes the world a worse place, leave a message. That discourse seems more useful to me at this point than revisiting the guilt question.
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Cheers for the link. You used 'em before? What are their overseas deliveries like? Iâm in Merrie Olde Englandland, and I know someone needs that âfuck your patriarchal bullshitâ pillow for her couchâŚ
Yes we would have. Only it would have gone like this: Man stalks and kills boy, is convicted of murder despite âstand your groundâ law
[quote=ânemomeno, post:87, topic:16927, full:trueâ]
Whatever you want to say about Zimmerman, he hasnât been a beacon of exemplary judgement (moral or otherwise) before, during, or after the event,[/quote]
Thatâs true. But just because someone did something wrong or stupid in the past doesnât necessarily effect the current issue at hand. Each incident needs to be judged on its own merits. Just like one could point out to Trayvonâs drug use, school problems, and thuggish posturing as reasons why he might have deserved his fate. But one needs to look at his actual actions in this instance to come to an accurate conclusion.
Two reasons: First is that I hold the concept of self defense highly. I donât want people to be condemned for what I feel is a âgood shootâ. Ironically, with all the race issues arising from the case, race often does effect whether something is labeled as self defense or not.
Second is that the whole thing has been one huge media spurned cluster fuck. The dishonesty in the reporting of this case is just appalling. The whole thing was politicized, making people pick sides. Whether you had a firm grasp of the details or not, you picked the victim based on which âsideâ you are normally on. People who would normally approach something with logic and rational dismissed everything that didnât fit within the narrative their side was spinning.
Race got thrown into it and it just blew up. I havenât read anything that makes me think Zimmerman was some sort of racist just looking to bag himself a young black punk. Now we have another set of âsidesâ to choose, are you a racist supporting Zimmerman or not? The pics used of Treyvon and Zimmerman were cherry picked to play out the narrative of some young bright young kid taken out by racist cop wannabe. It was worse than that darkened pic they used of OJ on Time or Newsweek.
Then we have the president chiming in once again on something he doesnât know about. Something tells me that if Treyvon was Obamaâs son, he wouldnât have tolerated the various shenanigans going on.
And to be clear - I donât think Zimmerman did everything right. He shouldnât have followed Treyvon as long as he did, especially when the 911 operator said that wasnât necessary. Obviously he let his situational awareness lapse to the point he was surprised and assaulted. But I also donât think he went in all trigger happy, determined to take down some punk. But nothing he did justified an assault by Treyvon. If I am on my back and getting my head beat on, I am going to use what ever means I have to stop that.
That didnât take long! Itâs the LIBERALS who are the racists. Not the gun-toting, bigoted freaks afraid of their own shadow (given the color of a shadow) and sees the bogeyman under every hooded sweatshirt.
Keep it real, yo. Your attempt to astroturf the comments here is funny.
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OOOH! Feminazi!
Nice one, very creative.
Itâs a song, a western, a book and a gun reference (caliber). It comes from an RPG character I had in Vampire: The Masquerade.
ETA - I gotta get back to work, kids. Maybe I can spare more tonight.
Of course, the plausibility of the given scenarios is entirely your opinion. Not only that, we can be sure you havenât exhausted the entire range of possibilities with your several examples. Finally, even in your âmost likely scenarioâ Martin may have been reasonably in fear for his life even without knowing Zimmerman was armed. Arenât you the one that pointed out that one punch can kill someone? Being followed by someone in a truck seems like a pretty scary situation.
In addition, you seem to feel the need to pull in irrelevant (and arguable) details such as the âfoolhardinessâ of Martin confronting an armed attacker without a weapon. Foolhardiness would probably not factor into a claim of self defense in this way. The foolhardiness of Zimmermanâs actions certainly didnât seem to factor into his plea for self defense.
As I just mentioned, one might reasonably disagree about what constitutes âthe most likely scenariosâ.
As far as our initial disagreement, the definition of âmurderâ you got from google isnât really relevant to whether or not itâs fair for private individuals to believe and express the opinion that Zimmerman murdered Martin. Nicole Brownâs murder was certainly an unlawful killing whether or not Simpson was found guilty of that killing. If a private individual believes (as probably millions of private individuals did believe and said as much) that Simpson is, despite the verdict, the perpetrator of that killing then it seems to me reasonable to say something to the effect of: âIn my opinion, OJ Simpson is a murderer.â A verdict of ânot guiltyâ only absolves someone of a crime in a court of law. Itâs not binding on the opinions of private individuals.
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Speaking of which, donât you think you should decry how Martin was âfound guilty in the court of public opinionâ on these counts? You know, for the sake of consistency?
Again, conjecture and not disclaimed as such. (We might reasonably be skeptical of the version of events presented by Zimmerman in his criminal defense given the seriousness of the charge and the nature of criminal defense as well as the lack of corroboration for the details of the encounter.)
Not really relevant to the discussion at hand, but is there any reason why you refer to Zimmerman by his last name and Martin by his first name?
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So one deserves death for âdrug use, school problems, and thuggish posturingâ? Are you really representing that one could reasonably claim that is a fair punishment in those cases, or are you just driving trollies?
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Geeze dude - my next damn sentence said exactly that.
âBut one needs to look at his actual actions in this instance to come to an accurate conclusion.â
His past problems should not be used to condemn his current actions, those should be judged on their own.
Iâm saying people on the flip side of the coin can point out that Trayvon was in trouble in the past and that means he was likely looking for trouble then. Which isnât necessarily true. People are often pre-condemned or exonerated based on their past actions, when their guilt or innocence should be based on the current facts and evidence at hand.
Apparently in Florida you do. And in other Stand Yer Ground states. And thereâs more coming soon â thanks, ALEC!!
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No, it didnât.
While I agree with the sentiment you did express, itâs not the sentiment that people pointing out Martinâs âdrug use, school problems and thuggish behaviorâ are âindictingâ Martin in âthe court of public opinionâ. Which was, of course, your initial complaint about people who disagree with you about Zimmerman.
But one needs to look at his actual actions in this instance to come to an accurate conclusion.
Not the same as going into a forum full of people talking about how Martin was such a thug and had it coming and telling them to knock it off.
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This âLawâ is bullshit and the people who trot it out are not very bright.
Dammit Xeni, Iâm very disappointment in you for showing such ignorance and lazyness. A little googling would have shown you that Prussian Blue can be made from blood.
Geez, the nerve of some people.
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I have not ordered from there before, Iâm sorry to say. I am very much in love with those shirts, though!
