“We’re not that observant. It’s mostly a Christmas and Easter thing.”
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We lost in 2000 when critical action dealing with greenhouse gases was punted (with the “Green” candidate helping fuck us into that by lying about the candidates being the same, except Bush being preferable) and conservative ideologues learned that they could get away with stealing elections and preventing any meaningful action in a system with failed mechanisms for addressing their abuses. At this point, Trump or no Trump, we were here to watch the end of the show, though he’ll speed things along. I’m a little pessimistic.
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If this were to happen, and that’s a big if, I think it would be pretty much like you say. New England + Mid-Atlantic through MD/DE would become one country, Great Lakes (OH through MN plus IA) would become another, the West Coast plus HI but not AK would become a third, and then everything else would be left behind. I for one love the idea of the Great Lakes being its own country, except that Downstate Illinois is more like Missouri than it is like the greater Chicago area, and Indiana is more like a Southern state. I don’t think the Upper Midwest is as politically cohesive as it appears, but the coasts pretty much are IME.
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I’m giving the people who say California won’t vote to leave the US exactly the same amount of credence that we now know should have been given to people who said the UK wouldn’t leave the EU. The fact is, I just don’t know what will happen between now and then. They are collecting signatures, and a real vote to actually secede wouldn’t be for a few years now. How much will the Trump administration alienate the people of California before then? What will the ballot box issue end up being? Imagine the vote happens on a day when ICE has Las Angeles city hall surrounded with two thousand Mexican immigrants running out of supplies inside under protection of the mayor.
And I agree that the traditional Republicans absolutely do not want California to leave. I’ve completely convinced myself Steve Bannon does. That’s the road to a white nation in North America.
I imagine it might end up being a compromise that generals talk Trump into to get him to stop talking about using nukes.
I don’t want to diminish how badly both the US and Canada treat indigenous people right now, or the really extreme level of racism that exists towards indigenous people. It’s because of that existing racism that I worry that a government of a certain stripe might one day decide to take things to the next level with round ups and internment. I think far too much of the population would be okay with that. (But as I say, that’s not some new thing with Trump, and it’s not just an American problem)
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Organisers call it cold anger. You already know this, but use it.
People need to stop reading 1984. Shit’s gonna suck, we already know it, so let’s get going.
A Gringo Manual on How to Handle Mexicans
For fucks sake people, don’t mourn, organize.
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3+ states? There are quite a few nukes in Jesusland.
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At some point in the last several weeks, I went from despondent to simmering. I have you BBers to thank for this. I have no doubt I would’ve made this transition eventually, but you catalyzed it.
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Haven’t reread that book in several years, despite its recent resurgence; real life is already depressing enough as it is, and I already know what the worst case scenario is.
Agreed.
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Those were two comments I should have split better; no intent to imply passivity on your part.
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No offense taken; I get your meaning.
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I am becoming more and more optimistic. Optimistic about the resistance.
A second Civil Rights Movement (or maybe just the continuation of the original) is gaining momentum. I feel it in the air.
Apathy is not an option.
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Well, let’s see. To start with, I’m pretty sure that there is no internal brake - call it conscience - in the Trump administration that would stop it from committing mass murder or some other large scale atrocity, and that is the direction it is heading to. So if no external force prevents it, it will happen.
I don’t know what odds to give on such external intervention. I’d like to imagine that impeachment or some other unambiguously constitutional way of getting rid of Trump is still an option. That would be the best outcome all around. Beyond that, things seem messy. How many people are there willing to resist in some way more substantive than posting on the internet or holding a placard? Public protest is an appeal to conscience - it won’t work if there’s no conscience to appeal to. What can public resistance accomplish if it is not aided by some of those in power? And is that really something to look forward to?
I’d say the US splitting into multiple countries is not as likely as some people here think. Even if political unity crumbles, there’s still the military to account for. It could be employed by Trump to stamp out any secessionist ideas, or it could lead a coup against his divisive policies (to who knows what ends) - either way, I think it represents a major inertial force keeping the country in one piece.
(And if it does break apart, the idea that the split would follow current political orientations is pure wishful fantasy. You must remember that the fall of the US would create a massive power vacuum and break the protective bubble of global hegemony which has so far kept American territory largely untouchable by the world outside. You would have all sorts of local and global powers trying their utmost to make sure that the fresh and malleable bits of America would come to represent their best interests. Ultimately, a new stable power equilibrium would have to be established after a World War 3, this time with North America as one of the major theaters.)
Closer to (my) home though, there’s this dawning realization that perhaps by the end of the year I’ll be living within artillery shelling range from an actual Russian border. Or, more pessimistically, on the wrong side of it. So there’s that.
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They are not when checks and balances collude.
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