I honestly don’t think it’s intentional. People like Rogan think they are being smart and inquisitive by giving equal time to Dr. Fauci and no-longer-Dr Andrew Wakefield. However they are also so drunk on privilege blindness and self-importance that they mistake their own feelings for “information”. On some level they don’t quite understand, they like what that Jordan Peterson guy has to say, without taking the time to figure out that it’s all misogynist and fascist talking points. Peterson, on the other hand, knows exactly what he’s doing. He’s the David Duke of fascism; suit-wearing and well-spoken so that the nice white middle-class people will listen to him.
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Call me when Joe Rogan himself disappears permanently, please.
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I don’t know… I think maybe Rogan likes it because it is misogynist, fascist, racist, and flies in the face of reality, from their POV. Also, the rule of goats applies. I don’t think he gets off the hook for “not knowing better”… plus he probably does.
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Well, and even if he did, there are so many ‘contexts’!
Even there, he is wrong. There are plenty of epithets which are only usable by those who the epithet refers to, just that effort has been made by those slurred to embrace the term as a form of internal identity.
No, I am not going to list examples. Mostly because the other examples haven’t been used as heavily as as a derogatory, dehumanising term as much. But they are like the original word (you know, the one derived from the Latin for the colour black) in that they are derogatory, but those belonging to the slandered group use it now and then as a certain style of defiance.
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The way Rogan said it, it was like when Trump would say, “Not many people know this, but…” and then say something that normal people learned in grade school and is still an oversimplification.
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Yah, for sure. I didn’t mean to imply he gets a pass because he’s absentmindedly racist, sexist, and a little faschy. Goat rule in full effect.
I think you said it better- it’s not that he’s ignorant of his own positions per se, it’s that he thinks those positions are edgey and interesting. He’s the anti-intellectual bro equivalent of an edge lord, maybe.
Like, I used to have a funny and very outgoing white friend who always had the room laughing wherever he was. However he also made a lot of right-up-to-the-line (probably over, not for white people to say) racist jokes. He considered himself “above the fray” because he was smart and felt he wasn’t racist, so it’s okay to make the jokes.
Then Ferguson happened and we were discussing it over some beers. In particular the viral photo of a phalanx of militarized police bearing down with AR-15s on a single unarmed teenager. The discussion got deep, and well, it turns out my friend is just pretty racist after all. We’re not friends anymore.
I’m glad that N-word supercut of Rogan is going viral because it is an easy way for people to see who he is and drop him. The rest of his damage to society is a lot harder to explain in a viral video. This is why people like Lobster Daddy Peterson are so hard to stop- explaining what’s wrong with what they say takes a lot of time and context. You can’t summarize his evil on a bumper sticker, so people think he’s “probably harmless”.
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I only see the random reference to him on sites like this and Wonkette - or YouTube has pushed a “watch Jordan own this liberal feminist journalist!” video at me that I could not finish. My only experience with trying to listen to him at any length was early on, before most people knew what he was up to, and it was with Sam Harris.
And what he did to logic there…it was so infuriating I have no desire to hear anything else from him. Especially if there is misogyny and so on, to boot. I have no idea how someone can listen to something like that and think it’s really intelligent. I saw someone saying something along the lines - “yeah, Jordan won’t let those scientists get away with the outcomes of their work!”, as if this line of so-called reasoning was the least bit insightful.
Before that interview, someone I knew was telling me that he and his wife like this guy. I took it as a mental note - both he and his wife are on the spectrum of liberal to leftist. I don’t know what they were reading/listening to from him, but somehow, he made an impression on them. And they are not unintelligent and not uneducated. I think they no longer like him, but shortly after I listened to that Sam Harris interview, I remember asking them both what they like about JP, because I found it so baffling. He was annoying and irritating in that interview, and, as best I can remember, his other problems did not even get surfaced in that interview. Add that on top, and…someone that still knows that must be only there for that part, because there is no there there when it comes to the intellectual part.
As far as his presentation style - a similar scam works for Ben Shapiro - there seem to be some people that believe if someone talks real fast in a Gish Gallop, they must be RLY SMRT. People seem to think that because JP keeps up that Canadian veneer of politeness even when saying very vile things (and doesn’t get overwrought himself when gaslighting others) that he’s the rational one in any given exchange.
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And that he thinks he’s immune from criticism if he pretends its “intellectual discourse”… and that he thinks he’s immune because of who he is.
Yeah. I wish people had realized that the first time he said it on his show though.
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supposedly former-death-cultist tom nichols has been using his twitter platform to distract us with the question “could pulp fiction be made today?” and he’s been argumentative about it, accusing those who say it could of not having seen the film.
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good discussion of the spotify “business model”–
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Most tellingly, they invest nothing back into music. Unlike a record label, publisher, or most anyone else in the music industry, Spotify devotes none of its profits to the development of new recordings.
In fact, Spotify allegedly does or did commission music, but only for dubious purposes.
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He is a master of pseudo-intellectualism. That’s probably where he most uses his psychology doctorate.
You correctly identified his Gish Galloping, but he’s mastered the trick of making it work in book form. That is, it’s right there in front of you, and you have all the time in the world to pick it apart, and it still would take more time than you have to do it, and there’s always something left that his cult can point to. Pretty much everything he says is nonsense, but he spreads it over so many fields that 1) he looks like a polymath, and 2) not even a world expert in two or three subjects can address all of it. It’s one of those things where an expert in psychology will look at it and say “well, the psychology is either meaningless, or it’s trivially true, but all the evolutionary biology and history and economics looks very impressive”. And the biologist says “the biology is complete word salad, but the mythological analysis is fascinating”, and the expert in comparative theology says “everything he says about this is wrong, but the economics and psychology…”.
And worse than that, is that when he’s called on any specific piece of bullshit in what he’s written or said, he responds with either (or both) of “clearly you’re not smart enough to understand my full thesis”, or “what I meant by that was [redefinition of standard terms to whatever would make him retrospectively correct]”.
When he talked about “Compulsory Monogamy”, and people picked up on that and started talking about the necessary consequences of that, he claimed that it was a technical term in biology, and that he meant social expectations of monogamy. Which is compounding bullshit, because while the term exists in biology, it doesn’t mean that, and social expectations of monogamy is precisely what we have now.
He also freely throws around citations, fully expecting that nobody will check them. Because when people do check his cites, then the papers don’t seem to exist, do exist but are unobtainable, cite himself in another book baldly stating the same thing, or are to papers which actually come to the exact opposite conclusions than what Peterson is saying they say.
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Not to go too far off-topic (because this is about Rogan, not the arseholes to whom he offers a platform), but I wanted to add to your great breakdown of Jordaddy’s methods by adding this from an earlier post (slightly edited):
this philosopher-as-bullshit-artist’s formula for success often runs thusly whether he’s lecturing or fielding questions:
Anodyne statement about the need to “get one’s life together” in a way that’s totally obvious to anyone who’s a well-adjusted adult with life experience. Often one of his “rules for life.”
Just-so story about gender or racial differences “explaining” why it’s now so difficult for poor oppressed white males to follow this advice despite it being the natural order of things.
Cherry-picked quoting of impressive study and/or respected dead white male thinker to bolster this view of traditional ways bogged down by feminism, affirmative action, etc.
“So, if QED all right-thinking people should believe this should we not also give due consideration to…”
Brief and oblique shout-out to bigoted or sexist or far-right talking point which is a more extreme version of 2.
Criticism of a society that won’t give this idea a hearing even though he’s “proved” reasonable people and scientific research support it.
Self-pitying story about how he’s been 'censored", too (usually followed by a pitch for money).
Someone else called him a “dumb person’s idea of a smart person,” but it goes well beyond that. He is smart even if, like many succesful charlatans, he believes his own BS. He understands that his fans aren’t only poor critical thinkers and ignorant but also that they’re immature and lacking in direction despite an outsized sense of entitlement, which also describes your typical right wing authoritarian follower.
That description of his followers also applies to Rogan’s fans, which is why he’s a regular on the show and why he’s trying to make a comeback there.
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So his fee per episode has gone up yeah?
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I love that.
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And now this…
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