Not that the United States hasn’t almost completely ignored this since 9/11, but there is still an executive order in effect, originally issued by Ford and later reissued by Carter and Reagan, stating that, “No person employed by or acting on behalf of the United States Government shall engage in, or conspire to engage in, assassination.” Graham is flirting with that “conspire” part here.
25 Likes
If Graham is in contact with individuals or groups in Russia that he knows or believes to be both capable of doing so and interested in doing what he says, maybe. Otherwise it’s “just” a stupid, hypocritical statement.
2 Likes
That’s why I said “flirting with”.
7 Likes
I’m not saying it’s ideal and won’t create its own issues, but seriously what’s the alternative? Either Ukraine cedes the entire Azov coast and Donbas (and very likely Odessa/Black sea coast, but maybe that’s their “concession” play) or one of his lieutenants takes him out. The fact is that the Russian population is being exposed to less outside information and more propaganda due to the sanctions and media being expelled from western nations. It’s hard to find much footage of widespread demonstrations on the open internet; the average Russian is only seeing what’s fed to them by the state. Gorbachev paved the way for the end of the Soviet Union from within. Putin has created “Fortress Russia”. The cultural and information sphere reality couldn’t be much different between the two eras.
On the other hand, if one of his lieutenants does take him out, which is the only realistic scenario for ending this quickly, there will be an immediate need to establish stable leadership and avoid escalation and further sanctions or resistance. With Putin there will only be escalation until either the government of Ukraine topples or he takes all of “Novorossiya” and Donbas.
8 Likes
Surely this violates Twitter’s TOS, right? RIGHT???
22 Likes
People are bizarrely assuming someone more stable and sane than Putin would assume control in the event of his death. That’s a bold assumption.
18 Likes
I doubt Putin’s assassination would lead to an immediate withdrawal from Ukraine anyway. The last thing the Kremlin would want to do in the wake of losing their head of state would be to appear weak and vulnerable on the international stage.
13 Likes
wow, what? Gorbachev and Putin as equals?? I can’t even…
No one wanted to assassinate Gorbachev except those who wanted a return to the old ways of oppression and hardline control of the USSR.
8 Likes
No. Gorbachev is a recent example of a Russian President forced from office without anyone putting a bullet in his head.
14 Likes
Not at all. Until the Russian population awakes from the propaganda sphere they’re in, I don’t see anything like good leadership emerging. Navalny is the main opposition and his politics are nearly as regressive as Putin’s. I don’t think the next Russian leader will align at all with the western sphere, but I also don’t see this current conflict ending with anything other than the complete overthrow of Ukraine’s leadership, ceding 1/3 of their land or Putin’s demise.
8 Likes
No, but it would lead to a lot of confusion and a stalling of the advancement. Russian soldiers would begin abandoning their posts (which is already happening when met with any resistance), the Russian population would become a chaotic mass of confusion and the government simply could not sustain the assault that it appears only one person on this planet wants.
Paint for me a scenario in which Russsia doesn’t blame the west for any negative result? A scenario in which more Ukrainian people aren’t murdered and their country razed? A scenario in which Putin concedes to either the unified opposition or his own people?
This whole discussion seems to hinge on risk aversion, which kind of misses the point that there are thousands (and potentially millions) of Ukrainians and Russians dying or about to die as we speak.
9 Likes
True, but they handled it so badly it gave Raisa Gorbachev a debilitating stroke.
6 Likes
Well it’s not like Biden ended his state of the union speech by saying “Go get him” two days earlier or anything
3 Likes
Listen, this isn’t necessarily a bad idea, and yes, everyone is thinking it. but don’t say it. Now, when it happens, we’ll get the blame. In fact, I could see Putin going into hiding (has he already?), Russia faking that it happened and will send pictures of the ‘proof’ and then use that as an excuse to commit something horrendous.
So, just give him a massive stroke instead?
5 Likes
Once again, the problem is a sitting senator saying this. 
It can be interpreted as a direct attack on a leader of another country. Not to mention, as someone up thread noted, it’s ILLEGAL for government officials to do that.
23 Likes
Lindsey, stop playing F#ck, Kill, Marry. You change your answer every time.
14 Likes
I wasn’t sure if I heard that right the other night and didn’t bother to dig up the transcript. Yeah, that was pretty jarring.
2 Likes
I mean, he’s not wrong … but he’s wrong.
Or, put another way, we’re all thinking it, Lindsay … but if you’re a senator you should know better than to say it out loud. It’s just not productive.
I’m not sure what would happen if someone in Russia forced Mr. Putin to take early retirement. A Russian civil war is almost as scary a prospect as Vladimir Putin on a rampage playing Pokémon with neighboring states. And, as a wise man once remarked, “Always keep a-hold of Nurse, for fear of finding something worse.” It’s too much to hope for that anyone who could fill the vacuum left behind by Vladimir Putin would be saner or more principled.
Which isn’t to say that I want Putin to cling on to power. I’d be thrilled if one of the guys in big hats who he’s been berating recently finally snapped and yeeted the fucker out a window (I can say that because I’m not a senator and nobody listens to me). It’s just that I find it hard to picture any good outcomes of what’s happening now. The transition to a post-Putin era risks being every bit as frightening as the current situation, and even less predictable.
14 Likes
I don’t even remember who this person is, but frankly, he’s kind of right.
Russia is not a democracy. Putin is not accountable to anyone. He can’t be removed in any legal way. He can’t be impeached. No matter how huge the protests are getting, no matter how large civilian discontent becomes, that doesn’t matter to him in the least, he has control over the police and military. And on that note: yes, the protests are huge, but also Russian media is not free media. The average Russian has no idea what’s actually going on, they only know what Kremln propaganda tells them. So no, a civilian uprising is extremely unlikely, and even if it happens it’s even less likely that it would achieve anything at all.
Despite popular (mis)belief his oligarchs have no power over him at all, they’re dependent on him not the other way around. (If one would tell him “hey Vladimir Vladimirovich I kind of lost most of my money, how about you reconsider” Putin would just say “do you want to keep the rest of your money? if yes then shut up and walk away.”) His military leaders are the same. And also, remember that little comedy he did at the start of the war when he called out his ministers/etc. like a school teacher his students? It was funny right? Well actually that was about making them complicit in what was going to happen. They are now unable to say “I had nothing to do with it”, if anything happens they will have to bear responsibility, at home and before international law should it come to that.
As for his health, yes, he’s not getting any younger, but also he’s the kind of person who dies at 99 years old, in bed with three prostitutes and two kilos of cocaine.
Frankly, the only way he can be removed in any way is for someone close to him to just literally take one for the team and kill him. (Actually, seeing how things had been going in Russia for a while now, I’m honestly surprised it hasn’t happened yet. These are all old Soviet guys, they spent their careers doing shady shit like that!)
1 Like
