On the importance of properly labelling those who kill people

“Pazienza is accused of murdering deliberately shoving and consequently causing fatal injuries to 87-year-old Broadway voice coach Barbara Maier Gustern”


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Needless pedantry which misdirects the topic and attempts to distract the audience.

If you cause someone’s death because of your actions, it’s generally manslaughter; if you plan someone’s death in advance that’s murder.

Regardless; the woman in question is still responsible for the assault and death of someone else because of her conscious actions.


no is arguing otherwise, but there is a major difference between murder and manslaughter, and there’s nothing pedantic about that.

You are entitled to your own opinion obviously.

Mine is that such nitpicking on behalf of the alleged perp doesn’t do much to advance the conversation.

BB isn’t a court of law, and the commentary expressed here won’t affect the outcome of the woman who killed an old lady.

In fact, the suspect’s parents are rich, and she’s White so she’ll probably only get a proverbial slap on the wrist at worst.


Bottom line; if you killed somebody, then YOU FUCKING KILLED SOMEBODY, whether you “meant to” do it or not. SOMEONE STILL DIED NEEDLESSLY.


How many synonyms for “dead” do you know?


As stated earlier: a person who commits a violent attack resulting in another person’s death can indeed be charged with murder even if the victim’s death was unintentional. For example, if you rob a bank and someone gets shot you can be charged with murder even if you were just hoping to make a clean getaway with a sack of money.

This particular suspect was charged with manslaughter, but it is perfectly accurate to state that she has been accused of murder as an accusation is not the same thing as a criminal charge.


Hell, in that scenario if you make a clean getaway with no injuries and the cops fire at you and kill someone, you can still be charged with murder. This was intentional (but not, probably, premeditated) assault resulting in grievous bodily injury and death. It may turn out that there is a hate crime enhancement in the offing, but we don’t know that yet. What we do know is horrible enough, and although IANAL, it seems the the perpetrator is being granted a heaping helping of rich, white privilege to go with her indictment.


In addition, this crime could have been premeditated, in the sense that the criminal thought about it for 5 minutes and then enacted her plans. There’s no way to prove that, short of a confession, which is why in such cases charging the perpetrator with manslaughter is a safer prosecutorial decision.


Sure, why not.

Just like deliberately introducing cyanide into a person’s body, perforating several of their vital organs with sharp objects, and then introducing said body into an extremely high-temperature environment such as to cause it to break down into its component molecules.

Any actual harm is strictly coincidental.

Sure, manslaughter.


That difference is strictly legalistic and is not made anywhere else in the English language. People don’t shout “Manslaughterer!” at killers because the specific details of the killing do not warrant a charge of murder in a court of law.

Manslaughter is not even used as a verb.


There is of course a difference in the meaning and usage of language in the general public than it’s usage in narrow technical or legal spheres.

It’s entirely within the dictionary definition of murder and within common usage to say she murdered someone. Allegedly, of course.

But it’s also true that to be fully technically correct in the narrow legal usage to note that she is accused of committing a homicide.

No one gives a fuck.


The word is “kill”. She killed the woman, “murder” is the wrong word.

Yes, she could have been charged with murder, but she wasn’t. That’s the point.

Well now technically, the bus killed her. /s

No, she hit her head on the ground after being shoved down and later died of those injuries, which were caused by being shoved. This is the definition of manslaughter.

So you’re saying it was the pavement what done it. Case closed! /s


Just gonna leave this here.

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Many people agree with this, and think she should have been. That is why she’s an “accused murderer”…

Which is why the VERY FIRST SENTENCE of the post clearly states she was charged with manslaughter.

You’ve chosen a weird-ass hill to die on, sport.


Hey, so long as…


Hey, semantics is important and he’s in good company here </snark>