Pink Floyd's Roger Waters calls Biden a "war criminal" and says "Taiwan is part of China"

[Jesse13927]

@gridsleep1

Mao Dze Dung was a great admirer of FDR for his popular and people-saving social programs, despite being a rich louse. When Mao reached out to engage in partnership with USAland, FDR rebuked him and chose the dictator Chiang instead. Mao was so disabused that he turned to Marxism.

Mao was a founding member of the Chinese Communist Party in 1921, so I don’t know where you are getting the “he turned to Marxism because of FDR” angle. FDR was also dead when Mao came to power. Mao was also a ruthless dictator and nothing that FDR did or did not do influenced that.

The idea that there could have been some great partnership between China and the US is a fantasy. The US could have recognized the CCP-controlled China a lot sooner, but that would not have done much to change the disastrous “Great Leap Forward” or “Cultural Revolution” that killed tens of millions of people and plunged the country into chaos for decades. That was all Mao. And he was not acting out as a jilted lover who had been rejected by the US.

[catsidhe]

@Jesse13927

And he was not acting out as a jilted lover who had been rejected by the US.

To expand on this:

Not everything is about the US. Sometimes people do horrible things all on their own.

Making everything about yourself is patronising and narcissistic.

[gracchus]

@Jesse13927

FDR was also dead when Mao came to power. Mao was also a ruthless dictator and nothing that FDR did or did not do influenced that.

And Nixon going to China in 1972 (mainly as a realpolitik counterbalance to the Soviets) didn’t change the murderous authoritarianism of Mao or his successors either, except perhaps to inspire the post-Mao incorporation of crony capitalism into their “Marxist” system.

@catsidhe

Not everything is about the US. Sometimes people do horrible things all on their own.

This is the core concept that tankies like Waters find impossible to grasp.

[LurksNoMore]

@Jesse13927

The idea that there could have been some great partnership between China and the US is a fantasy.

Maybe in an ATL where the CCP loses the civil war and KMT manages to be at least moderately competent at governing?

[gracchus]

@LurksNoMore

Maybe in an ATL where the CCP loses the civil war and KMT manages to be at least moderately competent at governing?

And doesn’t have a monster like Chiang Kai-Shek in charge.

[LurksNoMore]

I think not having Chiang in charge would be necessary for the competent government part.

[gracchus]

In times when right-wingers would see the White Terror and death squads as aspects of competent government, it’s best to be clear.

[DukeTrout]

@gridsleep1

Don’t forget that Chiang Kai Shek was a ruthless dictator, favored by FDR. Mao Dze Dung was a great admirer of FDR for his popular and people-saving social programs, despite being a rich louse. When Mao reached out to engage in partnership with USAland, FDR rebuked him and chose the dictator Chiang instead. Mao was so disabused that he turned to Marxism. The rest is history. Had FDR not been such a shortsighted prick, China and USAland could have been partner democracies engaging the globe in freedom.

That’s an … interesting take on that piece of history. Mao and Chiang were friends at University and Mao was always of an authoritarian bent. Where they deviated was not in the pursuit of power but the means. Mao believed in manipulating the masses while Chiang believed in military might. They were both wrong, as it turns out.

Anyone who thinks Mao was ever in favor of democracy hasn’t read the source material.

[Mangochin]

@DukeTrout

That’s an … interesting take on that piece of history.

That is being quite diplomatic in your response.

[Melizmatic]

@Mangochin

That is being quite diplomatic in your response.

Telling others that damn near everything they say sounds like complete tankie bullshit is generally frowned upon here.

[KathyPartdeux]

@gridsleep1

Don’t forget all of USAland’s human rights violations (starting 500 years ago)

The USA didn’t exist 500 years ago. It hasn’t been around for even half of that. The Semiquincentennial won’t occur until July 4, 2026. The first colonies in what would be the original 13 US states weren’t even settled 500 years ago.

[Mangochin]

Only man to write and sing a rock song about special relativity. Brian May had a fine singing voice and could have been the lead in almost any band BUT Queen.

Queen - '39 (Official Lyric Video)

[chenille]

But maybe the Iroquois were already setting a bad precedent by not making deals with the Ming dynasty, causing them to turn oppressive.

[anon61221983]

Amazing how we are such a powerful empire that America can literally do crimes even before it existed… leaving Europeans pure and blameless.

@chenille

the Ming dynasty

The Ming Dynasty when asked about Europe and the “New” World…

[KathyPartdeux]

[Melizmatic]

Yoink!

Truer fuckin’ words…

[smulder]

@gridsleep1

Had FDR not been such a shortsighted prick, China and USAland could have been partner democracies engaging the globe in freedom.

Ah yes, if just this one American leader had done this one thing differently, everything in China would be great now and also all the tankies in the world would love America forever

[DukeTrout]

[tcg550]

We saw this tour in a very small theater in Detroit, he absolutely did front a band for a while.

Him and Roger Taylor are addicted to the stadium shows but they could easily pull off intimate shows on a small stage.

Back To The Light is a great album.

He still does Love Of My Life solo and it’s beautiful.

Brian May-Back To The Light Live At The Brixton Academy 1993

75 and he still sounds like a kid.

Brian May- Love of my Life LIVE! at Glasgow Hydro (Queen + Adam Lambert)

[Mangochin]

Gonna check out Back to the Light. The title track is great!