What kind of military intervention would you like to see? And how do you see it playing out?
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Yeah, there are people here who live in Poland, Austria, Germany and Finland. There are people (like me) who do so and have friends and family in Ukraine and Russia.
This peanut gallery is not as far removed as you think
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Not necessarily true. In some countries, military service is compulsory, a normal stage in a young man’s life. Some militaries deploy them domestically for emergencies (like the U.S, National Guard), fostering a sense for them and the populace that their service is a good thing.
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At no point in the 50 or so years that Germany had compulsory service was there any sense in the general population that it was a good thing. At best it was seen as a necessary evil.
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TIL that there’s a Wikipedia article on this topic. To be taken with the usual spoonful of salt of course.
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Yes, of course you’re correct. I’ll add the word “volunteer” to my post.
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Well that was a disappointing read. Very myopic article focussed on the anglosphere (not that that’s your fault, of course).
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As you likely know, Wikipedia can be edited by anyone. Have at it! 
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I have so far resisted the urge to become a Wikipedian. I have a feeling it would take up all my free time.
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You’re new here, but taking some time to read a person’s actual views before jumping in with an extraordinary accusation is how we do things here. Otherwise go back to Twitter or Facebook.
Putin’s invasion hasn’t gone as planned in part because the West hasn’t rolled over or tried to appease him as it has during his previous depredations. More importantly, Western countries have done so in a measured way that’s hurting the Putin regime and its military force without expanding the conflict into the rest of Europe (where some of our other users actually live).
No tweet involved. I’m pointing out that direct military intervention by NATO, as suggested by another user, has a very high risk of escalating this situation into a larger European conflict withe a nuclear-armed power. Do you find this view, which is also that of most European governments (including ones that directly border on the conflict zones), somehow controversial?
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You don’t normally go to Grand Theft Auto games for this sort of thing; but GTA4 summarizes it as “War is when the young and stupid are tricked by the old and bitter into killing each other.”
Which is a bit of a sanitization; given all the other people that the young and stupid are also tricked into killing along the way; but it ranks surprisingly highly in terms of accuracy compared to a variety of sources that aren’t moral-panic-magnet video games.
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I certainly wouldn’t underestimate the utility of all the crates of high end missiles for making resistance to Russian armor and aircraft more viable; but we can’t understate the Ukrainian role in not rolling over or trying to appease him. I have no real way of calculating exactly how much I’ve paid for materiel for Ukrainian forces, US defense spending is hard to wrap your head around; but even if it’s more than I think it’s on a whole other level compared to what the guy who has to get close enough to use the stuff, hopefully without getting shot, is contributing.
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True and self-evident. Hence my qualifier of “in part”.
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That post displays a quaint faith that nuclear war can be limited once it starts. I’m afraid that’s not a faith I share.
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Thank you for addressing my ignorance with care and information.
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I don’t think it will start. Nor do I think just letting Russia/who ever walk conventional armies around where ever they wish because the possibility of nuclear war, is a tenable strategy.
Do we wait until Russia actually invades a NATO ally? and at that point do you think they will be more or less likely to go nuclear?
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He was responding to your introductory statement that:
On the basis of that extraordinary statement he’s not calling you a monster but rather a naif or someone who’s ignorant of history.
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You know, I’m not for appeasement, but I don’t remember any of these calls for immediate military intervention when Putin’s army was casually murdering civilians in Chechnya and Ossetia and Syria. If a NATO country was attacked that would be one thing, but until then, it wasn’t worth it.
I would like to think that wasn’t purely indifference to those people but some understanding about how more war doesn’t necessarily make things better. After all America was busy doing military interventions in Afghanistan, Libya, Syria, and Iraq – if I can use that name for its own invasion based on completely fake reasons – and they involved a lot of killing families too.
But now it turns out no, people don’t actually care about escalation and how many more innocent people would die from it. Putin is a monster and needs to be stopped by any means necessary. This time things have gone exactly far enough. I wonder what changed. 
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Unless it’s ‘opposite day’ and no one told us, that’s how I read it as well.
I called soldiers who are killing unarmed civilians ‘monsters,’ and I fucking stand by that statement; regardless to whose army it is, or what the color the victims may be.
There’s no zombies, no vampires, no werewolves; there’s only us humans and how we choose to behave; and some of the things we do are just fucking monstrous.
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If this is the same incident, one of the men in line, killed, was an American. If not, apparently russian soldiers are shooting up bread lines indiscriminately.
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