Some Mormons angry at church plans to shun children of gay parents


#21

I’m not sure if your question is serious, so I’ll answer it.

Everyone who hasn’t had a chance to receive “The Gospel” in this life will receive missionary work in “Spirit Prison” (yes, really) prior to Judgement.

It’s a common theme that very spiritual members are sometimes called home to do missionary work in the Spirit World in preparation for the big day. (That explains the good dying young.)

Those who decline the Gospel will have no place in the Celestial Kingdom among the faithful. The Terrestrial and Telestial kingdoms are heavens of a kind as well, just not as nice heavens as the Celestial.


#22

There are three kingdoms, the Telestial, Terrestrial, and Celestial. The Celestial Kingdom has three sections.

Only faithful church members may enter the Celestial Kingdom.

Only those who have received the temple ordinances may go to the highest level of the Celestial Kingdom, and there they will be as gods.


#23

It doesn’t mean that.

They assume that if you’re dead, you’re working on repenting of your sins so that when someone does temple work for you, you’ll accept those blessings.

Welcome to the fold, brother.


#24

I’ll be watching this thread, and I’m happy to answer questions.

For reference, I grew up in the LDS Church, served a full-time mission for two years, and married in the temple. It didn’t all come crashing down for me until my 30s.


#25

So, they need to know their “place”. I guess that there are still some mud people…


#26

@slybevel & @fray thanks for your responses. It was an earnest inquiry to understand the belief.

A follow-up: So, if there are no major repercussions for dying prior to baptism, are there major benefits / reasons to get baptized?


#27

The main benefit from baptism actually happens directly after…the conferring of the Holy Ghost.

Baptism is a prayer - You state the person’s full name, your authority, say that you’re baptizing, and close in the name of Christ. It’s a word-for-word prayer that must be done right or over again until it’s right. Each repetition requires a new dip for the baptizee, and the dip must be right as well or done again. (ALL the way under, not even hair can float.)

They used to confer the Holy Ghost in Sacrament Meeting on the Sunday following baptism, but some people weren’t serious and didn’t show for the second part. So now they give the Holy Ghost blessing right after the baptism.

The Holy Ghost blessing is a little more free-form. Full name, authority, confer the Holy Ghost, and then…say what you think feel The Spirit wants you to say. People get promised wild shit in these blessings sometimes.

“Having” The Spirit is a big deal, because it speaks to you in “a still small voice” and helps guide you through life. The poor saps without The Spirit are on their own.

Pointing out that you could live a life of debauchery, and die, and accept a baptism for the dead in the Spirit World, is frowned upon.

ETA - Also, baptism is the “strait gate” from the New Testament - You’re not a member until you pass through the gate. Being a member of the Church and having The Spirit are the two big motivators for baptism.

(Light edits, sorry.)


#28

Oh, it is, once you start reading about seeing-stones and golden plates and Egyptian papyrii and magical underwear.
It’s one of the weirder ones.


#29

Doesn’t the Book of Mormon state that God came from another planet? And believing that humans can become as gods then brings up the question of, then is God just a god and not The God?

You might not have an adequate answer for this. I’m not putting you on blast for what’s in the book of mormon, i just think some of the particulars in it are quite weird.


#30

You don’t seem to understand…

…I’m not in the fold with you – you’re in the fold with me!!!


#31

The Book of Abraham, part of the Mormon canonical book Pearl of Great Price, states that God’s throne is nearest to a star named Kolob.

This is the book that Joseph supposedly translated from Abraham’s own hand on papyrus that were sold to him by a travelling curio exhibitor/seller.

Joseph even told several people which star is Kolob in the night sky, but I don’t remember where that is.

No, the Church leaders have said it, and the Church claims the scriptures back it up in several places, but nowhere in scripture is it as the General Authorities (as they’re callled in the Church) have laid it out. For those references, I suggest the wiki article on Mormon Exaltation.

The Pearl of Great Price and Doctrine and Covenants, while not illuminating the doctrine directly, do refer in many places to man’s exaltation and living as gods, etc…

Lorenzo Snow, an early President of the Church, said:

As man now is, God once was; As God now is, man may be.


#32

Kids of gay couples. That implies the couples are openly gay and subsequently most probably married.


#34

You mean “a new religion founded in the 1800s that tells everyone it is Christian.”

Note, I spent a goodly chunk of my childhood living in Utah and had to learn a lot about Mormons the hard way. My mother still lives in Salt Lake City and lives with an ex-communicated Mormon as her partner.


split this topic #35

8 posts were split to a new topic: New accounts, one-time posters, sock puppets, et al


#38

I’m not a fan of alters. However, think about what first motivated you to sign up and comment. Was it on a topic dear to your heart? If not for you, I expect it is for many people. So, I don’t assume that new sign ups are necessarily outsiders descending on BB as opposed to lurkers finally getting around to making their first post.


#39

Yes, the Mormons did clarify their policies, to be clear that yes, they really meant them, with a few minor details like not excluding kids who’d already gotten baptized before their parents got married. Really really doesn’t help.

It’s one thing for the Mormons to declare gay sex to be sinful, or getting remarried after a divorce, or getting married outside their church. But punishing the kids for what their parents do? Are they going to exclude children of unmarried parents next?

And they’re clarifying that it’s ok to baptize the kid if they live with a non-gay-married parent, so I guess that means that if your parents get divorced, the straight parent really has to try to get custody or their kid won’t be raised in the faith. If the straight parent gets remarried, does that exclude the kid from getting baptized also?


#40

I did see you were speaking about this so I made an account today to comment on this one issue about the group of which I am a member. So what?

For the record, I commented on BoingBoing articles before they changed to the BBS, so this was years ago. I didn’t even realize I had to create a new account until today. Also, I tend not to wade into any comments thread or forum, unless I feel like I have something constructive or helpful to add. As the only actual believing member of the Church in this thread about the Church, I’d say that qualifies, but I could be wrong.

And I’m a real person, not a sock puppet; I’m not trying to deceive or mislead anyone about my identity. What a weird complaint to make, especially on BoingBoing, of all places! Why would I not be welcome here?


#44

I kinda’ like alters – it’s those straight-n-narrow ones that are incapable of change that get my goat.


#45

No hard feelings. Gamergate trolls are one of the reasons I tend to avoid comment threads in the first place. I get that you might be suspicious, but I assure you that in addition to being Mormon, I am a TOR using, copyfighting, EFF supporting, BoingBoing fan. (I’ve even read most of Cory’s books…)


#48

Go watch SLC Punk.