…uh…wut?
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He writes “assault style weapons” instead of the usual and inaccurate “assault weapons”
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Roger that!
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This is a good example of what I meant when (in another thread here) I though patriotism was a good way to bridge the divide in America. “Patriotism” doesn’t necessarily mean you have to be all gung-ho “USA USA USA!!!”, it means recognizing basic human values that are reflected in the Constitution and Declaration of Independence. “A rose by any other name…”
I’m sure everything he wrote is way over Trump’s head (assuming Trump even got past the first sentence), and the angry Twitter attack begins in 3… 2… 1…
This guy went into fucking space ferchissakes, he put his life on the line for his country, humanity, and science. Donald Trump has never done anything that didn’t benefit Donald Trump first and foremost.
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Unfortunately, it is very difficult to extract American patriotism from American fascism. They’re tightly interwoven.
Nazi concentration camps were inspired by US Indian Reservations; the Nuremberg laws were inspired by Jim Crow. The fascists of the original America First movement were highly influential until Pearl Harbor. The roots of American fascism go all the way back to the 3/5ths Compromise.
Even a noble exercise like NASA is not immune. The US space program was a spin-off of the nuclear arms race; it was built upon a foundation of giving wealth, fame and impunity to nazis like Von Braun.
The Trumpists do not respect the symbols of American patriotism when they are opposed. Remember “I like heroes who weren’t captured”? And Khazir Khan?
Just this week, we have this:
And:
And:
And:
Unfortunately, there’s a history to this sort of thing.
The pre-WWII German and Austrian Jewish community tried to defuse bigotry through overt patriotism; they volunteered for the army in WWI at higher rates than Christians did. But Jewish veterans were not exempt when the fascists gained power; instead, they were labelled as traitors and blamed for past defeats.
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He’d immediately be pigeonholed as a “globalist.” And the evidence is undeniable: with STS-122 and STS-129, he’s logged 374 orbits.
Somewhat off topic, that official NASA photo is amazing. I’m impressed with NASA for letting it through.
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This is like saying “once a criminal, always a criminal”, so someone who has served his time and repented and tried to make amends is still unworthy of consideration. I don’t deny nor defend any sins of The United States of America, but I have some optimism we can overcome our past (and history agrees with me here: slavery is not legal nor is segregation, and a tiny minority of Nazis have a gigantic uphill battle trying to bring it back. I think that qualifies as “progress” even if there are still problems.) Plus, realistically, you’re not going to get anywhere by advocating some anti-American let’s-shit-on-the-flag idea; the Trumpers may not be the majority, but the far left isn’t a majority either, so scaring away center-left allies out of some perceived moral superiority is counter-productive. Don’t let the perfect be the enemy of the good.
Anyway, if you think patriotism is such an evil thing, don’t tell me, tell Leland Melvin what a Fascist he is because of his patriotism.
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Fascist? No.
Pursuing a strategy that is unlikely to succeed, and avoids addressing the root cause of the problem? Yes.
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First: unless you’re a visitor from the future you have no idea what’s likely to succeed. (And if you are a visitor from the future you’ve doomed us all to act out the very events you’re trying to prevent, or so science fiction has taught me. Thanks a lot, buddy.)
Second: move the goalposts much? A minute ago you were saying American patriotism and American fascism were interwoven, now you’re saying he’s not a fascist despite being patriotic. There is more than one kind of patriotism, just like there is more than one kind of American; you’re playing into their favor by thinking the assholes of America have a monopoly on loving their county. Thanks a lot, buddy.
I guess Leland Melvin should have kept his mouth shut rather than “pursue a strategy that is unlikely to succeed.” Maybe you should go over his statement with a red pen and make corrections, “hey dude, this is what you should have said.”
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Nope, not a time traveller.
But I am someone with a bit of knowledge of history and a decent record on predicting and analysing US politics.
The “defeat fascism by doubling-down on patriotism” strategy has been tried in the past. It was attempted by centrists in the 20th century fascist states, and it was attempted by Democrats in the lead up to the present situation.
It’s a strategy with an established record of failure.
“American patriotism is tightly interwoven with American fascism” and “any expression of patriotism makes you a fascist” are not remotely equivalent statements. The first is true, the second is not.
Australian patriotism is closely interwoven with the genocide of Indigenous Australia; this does not imply that all expressions of Australian patriotism are motivated by genocidal racism. But it does mean that Australian patriotism is complicated and problematic, and is not automatically on the side of the good. You can’t use the positive bits without also bringing along the negative bits, whether you intend to or not. It’s all connected.
Yes, patriotism isn’t fascism. But, in the current situation, where the fascists hold the symbols of state and the left is openly calling for revolution, patriotism is not the best choice of battlefield. The enemy hold the strategic ground there.
I do not disagree with what Leland Melvin said, and I admire his motivation to say it. But attempting to shame the shameless is not going to succeed.
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Source on that? Indian Reservations were often the result of forced removal, but that is where the similarities end. “Gulags” and barbed wire labor camps hardly needed any inspiration, they were used in Europe and elsewhere before. While there were any “trails of tears”, including ones my ancestors were forced on, at least on paper those reservations were meant as mini-nations, not death or labor camps.
It was purposefully spun off into a non-military org as a sort of pro-capitalist move, having Boeing and Lockheed and others building the hardware and pushing the space race, not the government military like in the USSR. Before NASA and indeed early on with Explorer I, it was the Army and Navy building the rockets.
As for von Braun, one may feel his record has been sanitized and perhaps it has been to a degree. But as one who has read several biographies on him, most feel that his main drive was rockets and space exploration, not being a loyal Nazi. Remember any one who wanted to get anywhere back then joined the party. If you recall Schindler was also a party member. The Nazis made private rocketry illegal and thus there was really only one way for him to continue the work and get funding.
You can certainly say he was complacent in using prison labor and several other undesirable actions. I am not going to white knight him. He was also encouraged (i.e. told) to join the SS, but his rank as LT was largely symbolic (he wasn’t riding tanks). Obviously the V1, V2, and help with ballistics and aerodynamics helped the war. But he had been arrested and interrogated by the SS for making anti-Nazi statements and purposefully delaying weapons programs. It seems his time in service to the Nazis was a means to an end, which he later renounced.
I guess my point is he, like many people in history, was a more complicated person than your partial line of text gave him. I am not saying that label was wrong (technically they all were Nazis until they weren’t), just that there is more to the story than just that.
If you want to compare and contrast, Henry Ford wasn’t technically a Nazi, but hought WWI and WWII were a Jewish conspiracy, wrote anti-Semitic literature, and continued to do business with Germany until the US finally entered the war, including using prisoner labor.
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OK thanks for that. The beginning part reads more like an opinion piece with the relevant link now being 404d (the author’s take away from the biography). But yes, this makes it more clear that the intention of the article was Hitler admired how the US dealt with the “Indian problem”. It goes on to explain the similarities, such as dehumanization, justifications and methods used. All of that has parallels I can see, but your short statement made it sound like camps were based on reservations which begs for clarification.
i honestly think the target audience is everyone other than what’s his name and his supporters.
this kind of stuff helps remind everyone what is actually normal. stops us, maybe, from becoming complacent.
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Yes, this! 
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Sad to say, Trump will never read it. Far too long for him to attempt. Not to mention the content of logically-presented arguments backed by actual facts and far too many multi-syllabic words. No, he’ll probably return to watching his favorite video of his Nazi base chanting “Heil Trump!” played on a constant loop.
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This article states what the POTUS and the US government should stand for. Any logical person would realize that Trump is not that person. He has time to change but it time to change now. Value diversity and inclusion in all aspects of our nation. We once proudly led the world in Valor and in our humanity. Not anymore
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Methinks that although it’s addressed to him, its not meant for 45; it’s meant for everyone else who is not in his thrall.
He won’t change, that much is clear.
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