I don’t believe any argument I could make will convince Republicans to stop being fascists. If ANYONE has a shot at convincing Republicans not to be fascists it’s their fellow Republicans. So much as I hate GWB and his apologists I still support Laura’s decision to speak out against Trump.
I would love for this to be true, but I don’t buy it – do you have any references for such a statement?
It’s not the sort of thing on which you can easily find direct data, but you can infer it from a few sources.
Firstly, issues-based polling. This was a poll of 2016 likely voters:
Given that “likely voters” tend to be substantially whiter and wealthier than the average person, expanding that survey to the whole population would likely skew it even further left.
There are also age and race factors:
And see here:
Notice how a lot of the blue dots are hard against the left edge of the graph, while even Trump voters seem to be relatively moderate on economic issues?
The ceiling effect on the left and the empty right margin of the economic scale shows that the survey was miscalibrated; they assumed that Americans were further to the right on economic issues than they actually are. A lot of those blue dots on the edge would probably be significantly further left if the scale allowed for it.
On almost every issue, the public are to the left of both parties. Medicare For All has majority support, tuition-free college has majority support, cutting military funding has majority support, taxing the rich has majority support.
However, neither party supports these issues in Congress, because neither party is representative of the American people. The Congressional Democratic Party works on behalf of its donors, not its voters.
The non-voters are disproportionately working class and disproportionately PoC. Although the correlation is not absolute, class shapes ideology, and the ideology of the working class is socialism.
The problem with that is that every time the establishment Dems make a show of support for a “reasonable Republican”, they lose credibility on the left.
The people with the best awareness of this issue, and the most experience and energy for campaigning on it, are those most directly affected: people from Central America.
How do you think a Nicaraguan-American is going to respond to a celebration of the Bushes? They remember the Contras, they remember the death squads.
The message that they will take from this is “destroying Central American countries is fine, installing fascist dictatorships is fine, just make sure you do it in a way that isn’t quite so upsetting to rich white Americans”.
Why would they be willing to trust or work with Democrats after hearing that message?
Are you sure that Laura Bush is a war criminal? Aren’t you declaring her guilty by association?
That was a comment that I made in another thread. Anyway, Laura Bush seems to have opinions that are not always perfectly aligned with those of her husband’s family:
I’m not a big fan of Eva Braun, either.
However, I did use “the Bushes” in that sentence rather than “Laura Bush” on purpose.
But this thread is about what Laura said. Is she a war criminal that is not allowed to speak anymore? Should people be punished and scorned for the misdeeds of their relatives?
At no point have I said anything about Laura Bush not being allowed to speak.
But of course Laura Bush should be scorned for her complicity in the crimes of her husband. Once again: this was not a few misdemeanours, it was deliberate mass murder.
If she’d had any sense of ethics, she’d have cut his throat while he slept.
Guess somebody’s reelection campaign isn’t going as smoothly as planned.
I didn’t say I support Laura Bush. I said I support her statement against the Trump administration on this issue. That doesn’t mean I’m about to invite her over for tea.
I don’t see the point in getting angry at Republicans for expressing things I agree with. Heaven knows I have enough things to be angry with them about already.
And how soon will you declare that anyone who’s not raring for a bloody and violent revolution have no place in the left and no sense of ethics?
I sincerely hope you don’t talk like this in your everyday life, because I can’t think of a better way to make yourself, and through association other leftists, look like unhinged, bloodthirsty lunatics. Seriously man, what the everloving fuck?
This doesn’t look like regret to me.
Please keep in mind two things:
- The poll in question is one single Gallup poll. They survey people with land-line phones who want to chat about politics with random pollsters. So yes, his popularity rating is at a high… with bored retirees who don’t like brown people.
- 45% is not an “all time high” (that’s a lie).
Good points, thanks.
Sure; but Compassionate Conservatism™ required adhering to a veneer of decorum about this sort of thing.
The vulgar new money is just being so…gleeful about it; it’s distasteful.
Most likely never. Violent revolution is a last-ditch desperation tactic that almost always fails. This is why it is important to act before you arrive at that last ditch.
It’s interesting to note that I’ve spent the last two years here advocating for non-violent civil disobedience, based on the MLK/Gandhi model. I consistently argue against aggressive violence. And yet I am still routinely accused of promoting violent revolution.
Meanwhile, the constant mass slaughter of the US empire mostly passes without comment or concern.
An illustrative comparison:
Osama bin Laden ordered an attack on the USA that killed about three thousand people. It was a terrible crime.
A few years later, after bin Laden was assassinated by SEAL Team Six, the people of the USA publicly celebrated en masse. There was literally dancing in the streets. This celebration was thoroughly bipartisan, and the tiny amount of resistance to it was focused upon decorum rather than substance.
On the other hand, George W Bush ordered an attack on Iraq. Direct casualties were at least a few hundred thousand, indirect casualties over a million. The count is still rising due to the continuing aftereffects; we will never really know how many lives were destroyed by the US invasion.
This was also a terrible crime (and was not the only act of GWB’s to result in mass slaughter).
But, for some reason, the national bipartisan gloating over OBL was just fine, while a clearly rhetorical reference to the ethical justification of using force to prevent GWB’s crimes is apparently deeply offensive.
An important factor in this is that, to me, the death of an Iraqi or Afghan is exactly as offensive as the death of an American. No more, no less.
If George W Bush had murdered a million Americans, if he had been responsible for three hundred 9/11 attacks, how concerned would you be about expressions of hostility towards him? How happy would you be to see him walking around unpunished, rehabilitated and accepted by the wealthy elites?
When I say that George W Bush is a mass-murdering war criminal, I am making a statement of fact. It is not a political slogan.
In a just world, he would be dragged before the Hague, stripped of all wealth and power, and spend the rest of his miserable life sweeping up the rubble in the cities he destroyed.
The continued acceptance of GWB by the US public is an insult to the survivors in the nations he attacked. It is also a very obvious demonstration of the point that the victims of the US empire are not really considered to be human.
What kind of F-ed topsy turny world are we in where I find myself agreeing with Laura Bush?!?!?
I’ve got a theory that I sustained some sort of near fatal head trauma back in 2016, and my body is languishing in some hospital bed somewhere. That somehow this is all a f-ed up fever dream of a severely traumatized brain putting together a nonsense reality based on bits of scattered undamaged tissue that holds memories of the past.
there’s no place like home… There’s no place like home…
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