First, you’re the one that Godwin’d. So, ‘congrats’, you lost the argument, with the extra-special sauce of Godwining to someone that’s Jewish and the descendant of four Holocaust survivors, and doing said Godwin in defense of actual Neo-Nazis.
Second, it’s not the “difference of opinion” that I am having issue with–it is the willingness to act on that “opinion.” Especially as said opinion essentially summarizes as “People that are different than me are worth less than me.”
Third, holy slippery slope fallacy batman! Calling people out for their nasty beliefs on a singular basis and not when they’re being socially reinforced by being part of a crowd (as opposed to demonizing an entire ethnic group without nuance or detail) is somehow exactly the first step to rounding people up, stamping them with a number and sending them off to camps.
Its this mentality which walked the UK in Brexit and a big part of the partisan divide in America.
Trump supporters are going for a person they can personally identify with. Unpolished and emotional.
He sounds more like them than the political elite.
The reason Hillary cant put him to bed is because she has been sucking up to Trump and the rest of the 1% for her whole life.
All she has to do is make it clear Trump is the corporate interests buying the government and distorting the whole political process. But she cant because shes bought.
She cant start saying she will fight for the people when her campaign is paid for by corporate self interests.
Remember the wave of ‘Hope’ that created Obama. Did we get any of it in the end? Where did that wave crash?
Trump is riding the same wave of dreams but with a different name.
That’s my reasoning basis after giving this some thought. Like each of you, I also felt initially uneasy with this. I think @ficuswhisperer made an especially good point with people who are attendant for reasons having nothing to do with showing political support. I imagine there are at least a few in that crowd who are merely in-tow with a fervent relative or friend.
But.
These events are covered by all forms of media and that means anyone attendant may be photographed or filmed. By entering that designated space, attendees consent to being subject to that media coverage.
This twitterbot isn’t sharing any information that isn’t already public, creepy as its presentation might be.
I think the twitterbot is a little angry and partisan, but some of the reactions are far more scary. I understand that the election is close, both in time remaining and in the polling numbers. But the level of rage on both sides is very destructive.
Do you really believe that anyone listening to a Trump speech is an “actual neo-Nazi”?
or committing “An action clearly aimed at destroying the rights and safety of people of colour.”
You have to know where this much hate leads, right? You are literally denying their humanity. It is right in the title.
I do wholeheartedly believe that Trump is the candidate of choice for neo-Nazis, and that voting for him is an action that will help destroy the rights and safety of people of color.
I definitely believe that one. You’ve heard how Trump talks about Mexicans and Muslims, to the applause of his audience. You have to know where this much hate leads, right?
Do I believe that “anyone listening to a Trump speech is an ‘actual Neo-Nazi’?”. No, because I have listened to a few of his speeches. Do I believe that all Neo-Nazis eagerly listen to his speeches and act to spread them and use them to recruit? Yes.
And the fact that his followers have used his rhetoric to commit violent acts against minorities is a fact that is not in need of defense, plus the fact that he has repeatedly engaged in rhetoric vilifying people of color and saying how they’ll become effectively second-class citizens under his rulership.
Exactly. Just because not every single one of his followers is not brandishing a swastika or iron cross or wearing a white hood does not mean that he does not have the fervent (and hypocritical) support of people who actively believe that they should purge, with fire and sword, everyone else that is not like them from the country or world.
Yeah, there comes a point where the phrase of “I was just following orders” is not a defense against committing evil acts. I believe that that was discussed at a place called Nuremberg. And, in this case, they don’t have the excuse of being in a formal chain of command. They chose to take the time to go there, to spend the money and effort to listen to a hateful demagogue spew his bile. In the early days of his campaign, that might have been excusable, but, at this point, by arriving for any other purpose than protest, they’re complicit in his hatred.
I agree that most neo-Nazis will probably vote for Trump. But that is very different from saying that all Trump supporters are neo-Nazis. And the article goes farther than that, by including all those people who attend a Trump speech.
Just attending doesn’t mean you are a supporter. You could be a reporter, blogger, curious, or even a dissenter. There shouldn’t be guilt by association here.
While I fully realize most people attend a rally for the Orange Goblin because they are supporting him, that doesn’t make it right to point at and shame individuals without any further context. If there was someone holding up a sign saying, “<3 Trump” or “Impregnate me with your Cheeto sperm!” or something like that, well hell, shame away. This is different.
Isn’t “sharing values with neo-Nazis and Klansmen” damning enough? If I found out that all the white supremacist hate groups were supporting my candidate of choice I would have to take a very long hard look in the mirror.
So, would a setup that took this twitterbot a step further along the lines of
Hello, [insert name here]! Facial matching algorithms determined that you were in the crowd at a Donald Trump Rally at [insert date and location here]. Could you indicate your reason for attending by selecting one of the following options?
Supporter : Reporter/Blogger : Just Curious : Protester : Location Staff : Other (please explain)
be acceptable if that step was taken before the name or picture was released?
I don’t see that it’s shaming to present a photograph of someone in a public space. If they were there, they know why. And if they’re not proud to have been there, surely that’s on them.
Everyone who ever stood at the edge of a mass grave with a pistol in their hand, did so with the conviction that the people in the pit were the real dangerous ones, and always that they lacked humanity.
Look, you can very reasonably criticize the kind of individual shaming happening here. But when you talk about mass graves, do you really think the Trump supporters are the ones at most risk of them?
Because as far as that goes, right now the actions taken at denying the rights and safety of people of color seem much more serious, and my objection is that you seem to be downplaying them in favor of the victim-erasing “both sides” narrative. Some people are genuinely trying to hurt others here.
You think the people who OPPOSE the candidate favored by ACTUAL FASCISTS AND GENOCIDE APOLOGISTS are the ones who are most likely to be putting people in mass graves??
I’m not seeing any essential disagreement here. It sounds like all of you agree that neo-Nazis are supportive of Trump but that not every Trump supporter necessarily holds views that would make them even remotely a neo-Nazi sympathizer.
