I think part of that historical ineffectiveness is size and topography related. The MOAB lays down a pretty large blanket compared to those used in the past.
Non-violent tools, spreading prosperity and education and personal freedom. Might take a while for some of those to infiltrate the ISIS region
There was actually a recent survey via Washington Post/ABC, it’s reasonable to assume that pretty much the people who thought the missile response to the chemical attacks made Drumpf more presidential were the people who already approved of him. Similar percentages and all.
I think it’s safe to assume we’ll see similar responses this time around too.
Yeah, there’s no simple solution. Even the act of killing ISIS fighters may be counter-productive depending on circumstances - the bombing of weddings in particular seems like the kind of thing that’s only going to increase the net number of people who are aggrieved enough to kill
Except for the ones who get captured.
What a bunch of losers.
To be fair, most of the people who really wanted the USA to get more militarily involved in the Mideast did not vote for combover boy, and most of the pundits such as Kristol and Krauthammer who never met a body bag they didn’t like were dead set against him too.
Barrel bombs in Syria were initially used with chlorine, iirc. Conventional barrel bombs are otherwise just ordinary bombs, though their effects may be more “indiscriminate” in their application and associated with attacks on civilian populations.
The same (latter) case could be made for the MOAB - being such a large bomb its comparatively indiscriminate, so it’s application should be restricted (under the law of war) to concentrations of military targets and combatants only.
A lot of the aid that is given to any 3rd world country, even outside the middle east, is largely uneffective because governments, organizations and charities focus on the easy short term solutions. Buying new equipment that can’t be easily serviced or replaced, buying food that is difficult to fairly and equally distribute, building infrastructure that does not work for a particular region or doesn’t fit into how they’re accustomed to do things, etc.
It’s a systemic problem of developed nations forcing their lifestyles on people who don’t share the same values or views. Afghanistan will never get out of poverty until they feel like they have something to live for beyond growing opium and taking arms against foreign powers that constantly tell them they are evil.
Yes, this is a complex problem no one person can solve, but clearly bombing the shit out of them and then leaving with a MISSION ACCOMPLISHED banner does nothing to bring progress.
…Apparently a network of caves, so not as silly as I had at first thought. Because destroying structures that are deep underground actually ARE something that big bombs are useful for.
Probably plenty of contractors working there, though. In fact there is a tendency for ammunition plants to be GOCOs (Government Owned, Contractor Operated), in part so that the government can maintain an un-economic amount of surge capacity. Ammunition is something that the government tends to use small amounts of for long periods of time and then suddenly needs it by the metric buttload.
I think we both agree on what the right answer ISN’T (Bomb the shit out of everything), but yeah, what the right answer IS? Man. Shit’s complicated.
Via Axios: "When asked by the White House press pool today if he had personally ordered the use of the “Mother of All Bombs” on an ISIS compound in Afghanistan today, President Trump responded:
“Everybody knows exactly what happened. What I do is I authorize my military… we have given them total authorization.” "
Going to go build that bunker now …
Honestly I find that somewhat preferable. Like with some presidents I expect them to be a bit of a stopping block but not Trump.
A $28B cut to the State Department combined with trump’s obviously negative view of diplomacy kinda makes it necessary for him to start rolling out all the neato weapons we’re going to become familiar with.
Afghanistan specifically has been at war for 40 years now. Most of the people there have no experience of peace. Its just bad.
I guess that the “official” armaments industry would like to DMCA weapons so that “unofficial” people can’t make them.
Well, assuming it was an actual ISIS base, I am ok with them bombing it. Although this seems like a bit of overkill. Then again, if this is the one meant to destroy even in underground tunnels, I guess this is what you need. Hopefully this actually hurt ISIS and isn’t just a PR stunt. Or worse, harmed more civilians than ISIS.
First off, stock on defense companies don’t jump every time someone drops a bomb. I mean you would think that was the case, but no. I remember in High School we did a month long project where you pick and track stocks for a month. I picked several Defense companies like McDonnell Douglas and Lockheed because 1) I liked airplanes and 2) the 1st Iraq war was firing up, so I thought their stock would go up. The defense stock was flat or fell.
Second, so by your logic Obama kept using Hellfire strikes from Clones for money? Even if he didn’t have direct stock in it, odds are a mutual fund or something had some stake in Lockheed.
One can still criticize if this was the right thing to do or not, but saying it was just for money doesn’t really hold water.
No, the MOAB is still the biggest. It weighs more and takes up more space. The RF one is claimed to have a bigger blast. However, I have no intention of being around either to investigate.
It’s a thermobaric bomb, and MOAB does not stand for Mother of all Bombs. Thermobaric bombs are probably quite effective against shallow mines in soft rock etc., but against deep caves in hard rocks you’d think they were no more than a gesture. By now the Afghans probably understand how to make cheap blast doors.
58 cruise missiles…thermobaric bombs…and they all look like a particular portion of the male anatomy, which I think is pretty much the point.
Barrel bombs are cheap and easy to make… that’s like Communism.
It’s only been three months and he’s already into his “drop the most bigly, really the finest (believe me) missiles and bombs” phase to show everyone what big hands he has (effectiveness at accomplishing actual military goals is a tertiary concern at best).
At the rate he’s going I’m seriously expecting large quantities of American boots on the ground back in one of the sandboxes within the next 12 months and the use of an American nuclear device* within the next 24 months. Assuming he’s not impeached first.
More than 40 years. When various empires have shown a lack of interest in making it their graveyard over the millennia, the locals have just found new and innovative pretexts for killing each-other. It’s a real pit.
[* or an Israeli one that everyone will pretend is American]
Is it contagious? I thought that I heard of a recent outbreak nearby…
#ISTANDWITHMOOM
