So, if we dont agree on the number, then theres nothing to discuss. Since I’m disputing whether it’s right to steal $9000 from your employer. And you are apparently, now, disputing whether she stole $9000 from her employer.
And by the way, my suspicion is they got the number from her own confession (where else could they get the “8 years”). She told them what she had been doing. And how long she’d been doing it. So, $9000 is the least she could have stolen.
We do know that: The eight-year employee admitted the theft Friday, according to Tuscarawas County Sheriff's Deputy Brian Hale. Did she accept that she’d been doing this for 8 years? That’s what seems to be the point of the article.
[Note to self: This thread is getting too much like Facebook.]
Full time workers average 260 working day per year. Times 8 years that’s 2,080 her entire time there. The median stated being 4 slices per day equals 8320 slices lifetime which comes to $1.11 per slice.
8 years of service for some fucking ham. Quote Kant and the decline of the Greek economy all you want, that’s some inhumane bullshit.
I do. I know its hypocritical to say it, but intentionally stealing (at least) $5.00 a day for 8 years is different from unintentionally incurring a one-time loss of $0.25. And not just value: there’s also intent and duration.
If you’re imagining that they took her into a back room, waved a ham slice at her, and she said, “Yes! I admit it! I’ve been eating three to four slices per day for the past eight years at an estimated cost of over $9200!” then you have a strange imagination indeed.
Again, that claim “at least $5.00 a day for 8 years” doesn’t hold up to basic arithmetic even if you’re going by the estimated retail value of the meat instead of the actual wholesale cost paid by the deli.
What Is so difficult to imagine? They get a tip (a new employee wondering “Is this normal??”) Is it difficult to imagine them asking her to explain herself? To ask her what she customarily does and then ask her how long she’d been doing it? Then, they take the value of what she took and extrapolate. And this is just what she has admitted to doing.
I think some people here are focusing on the behavior of the employer (from what little we know, it seems to lack in mercy or proportion) while others are speaking to the behavior of the employee (absent more information, it seems duplicitous and greedy).
And still others are concerned with intent and harm, which are not quite the same subject either…
A relative used to work at Huntley&Palmer’s biscuit factory in the 1950s (I guess). Staff allowed to eat as many biscuits off the line as they wanted. Perk of the job. After a couple of weeks she never wanted to eat another biscuit again.
Other perk - taking home tins of rejects/broken biscuits for a few pennies. We liked that one.
There is little justification for stealing from your employer, but I contend without proper notice to this employee countering a common practice in the industry, this was not theft. There have been multiple rationales presented as why this is common in the food service industry, and likely served a benefit above the loss to said employer.
You know that repeating a strawman will not turn it into a man of meat right?
But to the point: No this is not “theft” as I said theres very little chance it qualifies as such under the law. And in terms of social/moral issues its the normal course of human behavior in our society. From a business standpoint with proper management this is accounted for and even encouraged. Because its good for employees and general company culture. Which tends to corolate with increased sales and better relations with customers. Typically the only people who consider it theft are companies with a history of poor labor standards.
And no. Small thefts do not become big thefts. Thats why people are throwing terms like “slippery slope” and “broken windows”. Draconian enforcement of small infractions and the elevation of routine social behaviors to the criminal. Don’t work as a way to prevent larger crimes. We’ve studied it. And the insistence that is often a tactic powerful people use to disadvantage, disenfranchise, and take advantage of the less powerful and well off. And on the smaller/personal level do not inexorably lead to large violations, or a personal downward spiral into greek politics. And its frankly stupid to draw a connection between ham snackin’ on the sly and political corroption.
You’re essentially making a “moral decay” arguement. Society is falling appart because of all these normal things you disapprove of.
I dont know if thats what you intended, but thats what you’re putting out there.
Wait what?
So in a situation where the stated level of consumption. And the claimed value of that consumption. As laid out by her accuser. When that doesn’t possibly add up mathmatically.
That some how means she must have stolen more.
Rather there being something funny about the accusers claims?
So she’s gonna minimize her infraction?
But the other human beings would not maximize their end of it?
The employee clearly did something wrong and is untrustworthy?
But the employer is naturally perfectly honest, and did nothing wrong?
Did she get scared she’d be deprived of her job? And when threatened with legal action she couldn’t possible afford to deal with as an hourly supermarket employee, by a vastly wealthier and more powerful employer, did she admit to killing Jimmy hoffa?
Life isnt clean. Society isn’t fair. And black and white morality doesnt work. The harm here on the employee is vastly more than the harm on the employer (and I’m pretty sure there’s no harm on the employer).
That isn’t right. Its Wrong. Its bad for society.
And frankly, however hung up you are on the word “theft”. However dedicated you are to the idea that bad is bad and good is good. And all things are just that simple.
It doesnt change that.
What? Why? Red onions are expensive as fuck compared to romain or iceburg. Thats not even good shitty cheffn’
I only steal ham. Because I’m a satanist and i would like to destroy society.
You keep ignoring all the ways we’ve pointed out its not stealing. As well as all the ways we’ve pointed out its not harmful even if it is. And all the ways we’ve pointed out that this generally isnt a concern of properly run businesses.
Repeatedly insisting it’s stealing. And repeatedly taking the hardest line, moralist approach on theft. Isn’t some conversational win card. Nor is an adequate response to the things we’re saying.
Because its the thing we’re disputing.
But how much does a slice weigh?
In my experince a fraction of an ounce.
I get jamon iberco, hand sliced right off the foot at a local oyster bar/market. Even at restaurant retail, and relatively thickly sliced its not $1/slice.
