It’s saying that Wyoming utilities companies are penalised if they sell more than 5% renewable energy in state. i.e. renewable energy is only ‘allowed’ to be sold out of state.
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I removed the posting restriction, Matthew. Please continue. You have been polite.
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maybe start a thread in dizzy?
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Wrath.
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This is not true. In fact, the opposite is true.
Coal isn’t a dying industry because of “regulations”. It’s dying because oil and especially natural gas are cheaper to produce. And now that a significant number of power stations have already converted from coal to natural gas there really is no going back.
And now, guess what else is becoming too cheap to be sustainable from a long-term profit point of view? Yup, oil and especially natural gas. Too much supply, not enough demand. All those great jobs in the industry? Half of the rigs, pumps, drills, trucks, etc. are sitting idle because it’s not worth the cost to run them. Not because it’s too expensive because of “regulations”…it’s because fracking technology has caused a glut of the stuff so the price dropped significantly.
Meanwhile, the real money is in developing alternative sources, especially mechanisms to capture and store the energy for future use. A number of European countries are already self-sufficient, and won’t need to rely on fossil fuels from the Middle East, U.S., Russia, or China. In an uncertain world, that’s a good thing. China is investing heavily in this area, too, by the way. Yes, they’re still using coal and oil, but they’re also actively developing better (renewable and cleaner) energy sources at the same time.
In the energy industry, especially for industry leaders, the real money is in developing renewables.
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You don’t understand the bill at all. You might want to read the article before posting.
Under this new proposal, power providers could continue to generate and sell wind to customers outside of Wyoming without a penalty—but they would be hit with a fee for providing that same power to in-state residents and businesses. Utilities that fail to meet the proposed standards would face $10 penalty for each megawatt hour of energy the utility fails to procure from approved sources and the utility couldn’t recover this penalty by raising customer rates.
The tax is for using renewables IN-STATE. You’re taxing yourselves, only.
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[quote=“Matthew_Edwards, post:58, topic:93359, full:true”]
Okay “Jon Snowden”[/quote]
Oh noes - you saw through my barely obfuscated user name. Well, sort of. That isn’t actually my name, but near enough, eh?
That’s it? That’s your rhetorical zinger? Oh boy, that left a mark. The argument about legislative corruption in Wyoming is completely undone by an absurd non-sequitur about firearms control in NZ!
Wait. No it isn’t.
Do you know why it isn’t? I mean, apart from that whole non-sequitur thing. It isn’t because I don’t give a flying fuck about your firearms control argument, because you are, once again, horribly wrong. I can have a shot gun if I want. Or a rifle. I can have a semi-automatic, or hell I can have a fully automatic machinegun. I can have a revolver or a pistol if I feel so inclined. I can even have a cannon if that is my wish. Although I no longer own any firearms, in the last couple of years I’ve fired an M14, a .303, an M4, a K98, a Mosin, an M16, an AK-47, a .44 Magnum, and a 9mm Browning. And those are just the ones I remember. I’ve also played with, although sadly not fired, a fully functional MG-42 c/w tripod.
I don’t care about your arms-control based argument because it’s as wrong as it is irrelevant.
Furthermore, even if - for the sake of the argument - we assume that NZ is deeply, horribly corrupt because everyone has a right to firearms … that still doesn’t let Senators Hicks and Driskill and Representatives Baker, Blackburn, Clem, Edwards, Lindholm, Madden and Miller off the hook. They are two completely different issues, do you see?
Well, sort-of honest. You need money, fine. Maybe you could institute an income tax? Or if you really want to tax electrons that cross state lines* then by all means do so, but why tax only the clean electrons, hmm? Why not tax them all? And are we to assume that it’s just a coincidence that the Republican senators and congressmen proposing this all just happen to have links to the coal industry?
Actually, I do NOT need your coal, thank you very much.
P.S.: corruption in NZ vs. corruption in the US … and I suspect the US ranking is going to be looking a LOT worse over the next couple of years. That’s aside from the ‘F’ Wyoming got in the link Mark posted.
* acknowledging @chgoliz point about RTFA re: intra-state vs. inter-state taxes.
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Unless you’re part of the established energy industry in Wyoming, I guess. Then you can have your buddies who make the laws ensure that everyone is forced to keep paying you to keep the lights on.
I love the smell of astroturf in the morning.
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Whatever energy policy, grid trader, local corruption monitor and steel co-generation wonks you’re following this year, they seem to be tailing things by half a decade so far. Not as bad as the set-the-clock-200-years-back-the-20th notions would suggest, but you seem to have caught some of the wake.
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I reckon I’d rather pay the men who actually created the resource through hard work and fortitude. Of course, that’s hard to do when powerful state actors are taking their cut, Tammany Hall style.
Wyoming has enormous wind power production right now and the potential for much more. Most of the present day production is sold to out-of-state markets, but it provides for jobs within the state. There is only one reason to push a bill that taxes exported wind power: regulatory capture of a corrupt legislature by an entrenched, fading industry. There are paychecks being earned in Wyoming right now by men (mostly) who work in the wind power industry. Building turbines. Servicing turbines. Manning control rooms that regulate the flow of power from turbine fields.
You 'd like to pretend they don’t exist and don’t count. Tell you what: you get that tax. Enjoy it. And send young men out of Wyoming in droves. Because there are plenty of nearby places that will keep sending wind power to the grid irrespective of Wyoming’s corruption. In the end, money talks and bullshit walks. And there are no bullshitters like Trump bullshitters, boy howdy. Roll coal and… live high off someone elses hard earned money. That’s the ticket!
I work in the renewable power industry. In the intermontane West. We will beat you natural-born failures in the fossil fuels business. On the basis of our superior product. Irrespective of how many state assemblymen you purchase and all the internet “commenters” you hire.
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LOL. That’s bill is so ridiculous it’s almost hilarious. What’s next? A bill saying that by 2019 all cars in WY must run on steam + coal? That will surely bring the coal jobs back! Think of all the people who will be required! One coal shover per car! Let’s make america’s lungs black again.
You couldn’t make up this shit if you wanted to…
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I live in a state which has huge stores of brown coal, from which much of our energy comes right now. There is zero interest in building new coal power plants, even from the coal industry. The only question is which plants do we close first, and how long to keep the newest plants running.
It is enormously expensive to build these large combined mining and power generation plants. Much more expensive than renewable alternatives.
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I can’t afford a prious.
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Wyoming is taxing their own people for not using coal energy. Not the same.
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I think you are a little bit mixed up…
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Strangely, conservatives aren’t that good at conservation…
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I’ll take that over a charcoal nightmare, thanks again for your POV!
my 2c is that you have a point, but you’re not here to hear any counterpoint to it.
This too shall pass.
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I think you’re missing the point still, which is that the externalities caused by burning coal are not factored into the costs of production, which is an implicit subsidy for coal. This goes for other fossil fuels as well. Since there is potential for catastrophic civilization-ending consequences, the “subsidies” in question have the potential to be almost infinitely large.
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Citations, please.
How do they fuel the vehicles they need for transport, construction, etc.?
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As far as I can tell Republicans are not participating in a democracy. The rule of law in general is inconvenient and boorish…I’m pretty sure if they could go back to Runnymede in 1215 they’d prevent the Magna Carta from every being signed.
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