Who is “we all”? I don’t know enough about architecture or engineering to have expected anything one way or the other.
Are you saying that a bunch of architects and engineers would have said they were surprised, and then we would believe them? That’s kinda different.
We got a whole lotta “why do we even bother, you’re not going to believe the structural engineers who explain it anyway.”
Right, this is kind of paraphrasing what I was saying, “Loose Change” is pretty compelling when you first see it, but then you realize there is a lot of selective editing and stuff left out. Any good propaganda film seeks to convince you of some idea, whether it’s true or not. “Loose Change” is a well-done propaganda film, it just wasn’t made by some huge government machine.
Or was it?
[edit: WAKE UP SHEEPLE!]
Well, most of the time when a building of that size catches on fire firefighters show up and help out.
At the time, they were incredibly busy across the street. So it burned.
Well, go on then. Say it!
Crazy people selling crazy to other crazy people, GOT IT!
How many years have you been parroting that line, exactly?
I’d guess <14.
Conspiracy theories often entail dubious and even false claims, but it is irresponsible to frame doubt about the official 9/11 narrative as a trait belonging solely to the 9/11 truther camp.
As other commentators here have pointed out, the 9/11 attacks certainly played into the hands of the Bush administration, who as we all know produced a whole series of lies in order to galvanize support for the Iraq and Afghanistan Wars, the passage of the Patriot Act, and the creation of the DHS, which famously coordinated the national crackdown on the Occupy encampments in October 2010, and which continues to invest an inordinate amount of resources, like numerous other law enforcement and intelligence agencies, in suppressing and discrediting popular social movements.
Given what we know about the history of false flag operations carried out by the world’s governments, it is not beyond belief that the U.S. government should actually allow these attacks to be carried out, or sponsor them, even putting aside the normal litany of objections proposed by truthers. Events like the Gulf of Tonkin, Pearl Harbor, and the sinking of the Lusitania remind us that some reasons for war need only be imaginary or at best half-truths. We are talking about a government, after all, that only recently in its history dispensed with the shame of segregation, only a century before that brought to a close the horrific genocide against Native Americans, and now sports the highest per capita prison population in the world, which many critics rightly point out as the de facto replacement for the institution of slavery, and which is now growing to include the newer prisons being built to house immigrant families.
We are also faced with the genocide perpetrated by the same government in the Afghanistan and Iraq wars, which some experts put at about 8 million war-related deaths. A much more conservative estimate published earlier this year suggests 1.3 to 2 million deaths in the Iraq War, or about 10 times more than official estimates. Undoubtedly the War on Terror, sadly the most profound legacy of the 9/11 attacks, feeds on such critical misinformation, from the reasons for war to the overall body count.
Frankly, while the truthers’ claims may be dubious, there is little reason to suspect that a government that, together with its precedents, has thrived on slavery, genocide, imperialism, and racism for 500 years will be honest and forthright with the world when it commits a crime, or allows one to be committed, against its own people. We don’t need conspiracy theories to identify acts of terror committed by the U.S. government because most of them are committed in the open, or at least behind prison walls. In my view, we ought to leave the truthers to their margins and reserve the mainstay of our derision for the bulk of the mainstream political spectrum, whose adherents, from hard-line reactionary to saintly reformist, continue to legitimize the existence of the U.S. government, and by extension its laundry list of crimes.
Just like how JFK could not have been killed by a loser like Lee Harvey Oswald. Only a massive conspiracy by powerful people could kill the president of the US.
Like I said before, I used to work at a space museum and was prepped on answering moon hoaxer questions. Though thankfully we didn’t get a lot of them. Pretty much every moon hoaxer just asks questions that have readily available answers - especially now with the internet.
A claim that nobody here has made, so your post here is of questionable intent and value.
I didn’t say that anyone “claimed” that only the truthers are doubtful–only that the narrative in this article and in many of the comments is “framed” that way. I actually used the phrase, “frame doubt.” Perhaps your grasp on language, or your cheap one-liner, is questionable?
Most of the discussion here simply amounts to deriding a marginal group rather than discussing the relationship between the truthers’ claims and actually reasonable doubts about the official 9/11 narrative. An article with a critical discussion of the 9/11 events and their aftermath, without any mention of the truthers at all, would have been more fitting, and frankly less lazy. Since today is the anniversary, I would expect a more serious discussion than basically trolling a discredited sub-sub-sub-culture. This kind of, “Hey, they’re like TRUMP!” mentality just cheapens the whole subject.
yes, Al-Qaeda had the plan to overturn the Saudi government - but bin Laden was sponsored by Saudi Arabia in afaik Afghanistan and Sudan in the 80s and was one of the richest and best-connected citizens. Surely the Saudi security apparatus monitored him?
Perhaps. But I do remember the construction workers report and that of the recyclers who said that there were puddles of melted steel. I’d rather give them the benefit of the doubt rather than label those people truthers. My guess is that those reports were made in good faith, to the best of their ability, and without agenda. I expect your construction foreman reports are less truther and more ‘somebody need to haul this stuff out of my work site’. In any case, it’s quite easy to reach molten steel temps when you burn the top of a very tall tower owing to the stack effect creating something very much like a blast furnace out of the structure.
Well, that’s no special anti-truther conspiracy, “A collection of really helpful and informative posts and links against a backdrop of Trump jokes” is pretty much how all bbs threads tend to go…it’s fun once you get the hang of it!
Were oxyacetylene cutting torches used during the removal of debris? You can make puddles of molten steel that way, and people working the site later wouldn’t necessarily know that’s where they came from.
IDK, have ya seen footage from other angles? There was definitely more to it than just aircraft impact.
Via: Imgur
I think that is the nicest thing anyone has ever said to me.
