Those we honor chose to make that sacrifice. The murdered black people CK protests for did not choose to sacrifice their lives to the police. Again, here is the disparity.
Respect to the citizens of the country (of any country) should always supersede its symbolism.
/onions
Their main goal is to manufacture situations that they can use to file law$uit$. Those not in the inner circle may be fooled into thinking they protest in the name of Dog, but it’s all about the money.
“O Lord our Father, our young patriots, idols of our hearts, go forth to battle – be Thou near them! With them – in spirit – we also go forth from the sweet peace of our beloved firesides to smite the foe. O Lord our God, help us to tear their soldiers to bloody shreds with our shells; help us to cover their smiling fields with the pale forms of their patriot dead; help us to drown the thunder of the guns with the shrieks of their wounded, writhing in pain; help us to lay waste their humble homes with a hurricane of fire; help us to wring the hearts of their unoffending widows with unavailing grief; help us to turn them out roofless with little children to wander unfriended the wastes of their desolated land in rags and hunger and thirst, sports of the sun flames of summer and the icy winds of winter, broken in spirit, worn with travail, imploring Thee for the refuge of the grave and denied it – for our sakes who adore Thee, Lord, blast their hopes, blight their lives, protract their bitter pilgrimage, make heavy their steps, water their way with their tears, stain the white snow with the blood of their wounded feet! We ask it, in the spirit of love, of Him Who is the Source of Love, and Who is the ever-faithful refuge and friend of all that are sore beset and seek His aid with humble and contrite hearts. Amen.”
this is also disingenuous bullshit because for the people who are deliberately and extravagantly missing the point the right time to protest police brutality against people of color is precisely never. if you thought that was a reasonable comparison on that basis you missed the mark, entirely.
i don’t know if even privilege explains that kind of twisted logic.
Real talk; there’s a vast world of difference between protesting loudly and hatefully at a soldier’s private funeral because you’re convinced that you alone are “God’s favorite,” and protesting quietly at a national sporting event because POC are systemically and disproportionately killed by the police.
word!
i say again . . .
WORD!!!
Wait. Why does the flag only represent the military now? What about the rest of us?
Sacrifice generally entails surrendering or offering. But yes.
But I don’t think we can get past the point that you seem to believe that any opposition to CK’s method of protest is necessarily a racist statement opposing his reasons for protest.
At the same time, any concerns that refusing to stand might indicate disrespect for those we are standing in honor of, is a triviality, and those who feel that way are just halfwits.
There are at least two groups of people who seem to be doing that, and trivializing the concerns of the other party.
The flag generally is a symbol of the whole country. During colors, or when used in a military funeral, it is more specifically about those who have served and given their lives for the country.
"It provides us a brief moment to reflect on its meaning, and to also reflect on the millions of men and women who have worn the cloth of our nation and protected its shores from our foes since 1776… (and) enable us to honor those service members who have gone before us and provide credence to their actions.” Col. Robert W. Gates, Marine Corps Recruit Depot San Diego, 2011.
The Marine Corps, when we learned about the colors ceremony, the word “sacred” was used literally. People who take that sort of thing seriously are not going to be readily convinced that the flag and the anthem are now about police violence or whatever. And as I have said before, calling them names is not likely to change that.
Maybe we should be looking for a way to honor both those lost in service to our country, and innocents lost to police violence, as opposed to replacing one with the other. I know there is some frustration for people like me that want to address both concerns. I totally understand the need to make police violence an issue. But why do we have to do that in the one minute a week when we stand and honor the dead veterans?
true, they are (1.) the racists and (2.) the reflexive conservatives who are nearly continuously misinformed by the fox “news” network.
edited to add–and there is some overlap between the two.
I have a better question – why are we even expected to stand and honor dead veterans before a fucking football game?
It’s expected of all True Americans to play the national anthem before entertainment- just like on The Apprentice.
Yeah - it’s also not about fallen service members- I’ve never heard that even asserted before today- that is rightfully why we have Memorial Day.
Excellent question.
At military functions and services it makes sense; at sporting events that people pay to attend? Not so much.
Also, what @SenorSchaffer said;
Since when did the flag become a symbol of the the US military, instead of a symbol for the equality of ALL Americans? And since when did symbols become more important than the actual things they are supposed to symbolize?
Since black people started protesting?
(Rhetorical questions answered with another rhetorical question.)
What a co-inky-dink.
And there are many veterans who support his right to protest on this issue- even if they wouldn’t do so - and quite a few who supported him by taking a knee.
These are the freedoms they sacrificed for.
Because the US military spends a huge amount of money in order to maintain and expand the catastrophically destructive militarism that pervades American culture.
Yeah, thanks. My q was rhetorical, but I guess the obvious does have to be spelled out for some people.
Respect!
First off, let’s clear the air.
I have been discussing this firmly but fairly. Please don’t embellish. I have not insinuated anyone is a half-wit, stupid, or mentally impaired in any way. We’ve both been BB members for quite a while, so please afford me the fairness I have afforded you.
But I don’t think you understand why I do.
Bear with me, because I’m putting a lot of thought and effort into this post.
First, let me lay some groundwork:
Generally, I believe much of the problem stems from most white Americans’ lack of understanding about their place of privilege in society.
Some white Americans harbor an extremely prejudiced point of view towards African-Americans. Mistakenly, people often refer to them as racists, when they actually mean bigots, in much the same way many people call our republic a democracy, or how conservatives mistakenly refer to leftists as liberals.
Racism, with a capital R, is a general sentiment upheld by a dominant group in society which supports racial discrimination (as an action) by creating a system that infringes, inhibits, and generally complicates the lives of the non-dominant groups, namely African-Americans. Racists can be both a group of extremely opinionated bigots or even non-bigoted people who just happen to benefit from the system that has existed for decades, giving them advantages, preference, and a general benefit of the doubt.
Now…as it stands, there is no space in our country where an African-American can express their displeasure about our systemically racist society and feel truly safe in doing so. Generally, they have no shelter or recourse with the police, because this is the arm of the government that disproportionately harasses, attacks, or kills them on a regular basis without full application of just law.
Furthermore, up until a certain point, CK had responsibilities as a professional football player. Games, practices. He couldn’t traverse the country on a daily basis for protesting, which wouldn’t make much sense, because he was in the most advantageous place he could be to get his message across. National TV coverage. Sports reporting. All in one convenient venue, and at arm’s length from anyone who might do him harm for speaking out/kneeling, something most black people could only dream about.
Now, the reason that I “believe any opposition to CK’s protest is a racist statement opposing his reasons to protest” is tied directly to privilege.
Historically and generally, white people have been uncomfortable or fearful of African-Americans occupying the same space, literal or virtual, unless they are in service to the dominant group, white people.
In contrast to African-Americans, white people have almost all spaces open to them, the police acting as a physical and legal barrier to access against African-Americans who are not in service to white people’s interests.
So, this is a trigger, an African-American protesting a police force that serves the white interests.
It triggers the conservatives who profit directly from marketing the armed forces to football fans (this is a Known Thing, which CK’S protests directly affect).
It triggers team owners, especially conservative ones, who are viewed as not able to keep their black players under control.
It triggers football fans who view African-Americans as only worthy to pass the barrier if they play good football.
It triggers corporations who market to those fans.
It triggers the bigots who oppose African-Americans through their prejudice and hatred, and poison the minds of other impressionable football fans (i.e., people who destroy their Nike gear).
And so on and so on until you have a strong opposition movement, (with thanks to social media for fueling the fire).
