In other words, the truth about American politics?
5 Likes
The problem is that more Democrats voted for Clinton, but more people willing to vote for Democrats prefer Sanders. The party chose to go with the candidate the party wanted, instead of the candidate the rest of the country was willing to support them over.
This is political suicide, plain and simple, and I predict that this election will have an all time record low voter turnout.
6 Likes
Isnāt that how political parties are supposed to work?
2 Likes
Because sometimes they wonāt listen, and you need to let your buddy wake up bleeding in a dumpster covered in their own feces before they decide for themselves that maybe they should look into AA.
The problem isnāt that Trump might win, the problem is that we have allowed our political process to degrade so badly that someone like Trump is able to run, let alone be nominated.
And the reason that happened is because we kept accepting the lesser evil. Instead of ever saying āno, you have to do better than thatā, we just threw our support behind whoever wasnāt the other guy. Every time we do that, our options get worse the next time around. Eventually you end up with the choices being so bad that even someone like Donald Trump has a chance- And mind you, half the reason is because there are millions of people on the right going āwell, sure- Heās terrible, but at least heās not Hillary!ā
If she wins, superficially nothing much will change, but things will get ever so slightly worse regarding economic inequality and military industrial rule. More importantly, because nothing looks that much different, we all become more complacent, more willing to accept whatever the next shitty option is, and lose just a little more hope of actually fixing things.
And hereās the key: The debt bubble is going to burst, and our environment is collapsing. Every day we put off making massive changes to how we deal with these issues, their eventual failure becomes more catastrophic, more inevitable, and more irreparable. Hillary means perhaps 8 more years of token gestures while the problem grows, and by that point I honestly believe that we will be past the point where anything can be done. I cannot overstate the seriousness of this. The ocean is dying. If we let that happen, we are literally talking about the very real chance of our own extinction.
With Trump, we know weāre getting a dumpster fire. There is at least a marginal chance that it will end with a strong corrective action. I would literally rather deliberately crash the bus into a tree and hope I survive, than just ride along while we take a fatal dive off a cliff.
1 Like
So far everyone Iāve heard espouse this position is a white male. If you donāt mind me asking, does this describe you as well?
3 Likes
Yes. And this goes back to all the talk about the primaries being rigged.
Political parties are private organizations. They can run according to whatever rules they want. They can select or exclude whoever they damn well please. They are under no obligation to serve anyoneās interests but their own.
All of which would be fine if they didnāt have a complete monopolistic stranglehold on our entire government.
3 Likes
OK, then bear with me for just a moment.
Why do you think that it is almost exclusively white men on board the ālet Trump win so the whole thing comes crashing down and we can start over againā train?
Do you think that it might be because we white men have far less to lose from a Trump Presidency than everyone else?
8 Likes
Yes, but I said this about Cruz as well- And Iām a very out and vocal member of a religious minority who would have been at risk under him. As in, the dominionist groups heās tied to literally make me fear for my safety. I was still advocating this position when it looked like heād win over Trump.
I also donāt think itās fair to use the privilege argument to justify voting for someone who has a consistent record of fucking over the third world. Sure- weāll be better off under Clinton, but weāre not the ones in the mideast being bombed, killed, maimed, displaced, and orphaned.
1 Like
That would be a legitimate reason to allow a Trump Presidency if he hadnāt already promised to make war crimes (including torture and intentionally blowing up civilians) a central part of his foreign policy.
5 Likes
At least he lacks legitimacy. Iām pretty sure that congress and the rest of the world are a bit less likely to assist him with those goals than they would be with helping Clinton do the same thing.
And jesus- What kind of a shit sandwich are we being fed when weāre actually having to think about which of our prospective presidents will have an easier time raping and pillaging the third world?
3 Likes
The person I knew who was in that dumpster overnight died. Literally. At 18 years old. Setting him on fire would have been superfluous.
I would rather:
(a) avoid an actual, known disaster, which we are aware will destroy us
(b) get an answer from the person I asked a question of, rather than have someone put words in their mouth
But thank you for letting me know that you support Trump! I can now mentally write off everything you say in the future as insane. Yay!
8 Likes
There is no way to avoid the disaster. Itās a question of whether we still have the ability to mitigate or recover from it.
The longer we delay, the worse our chances.
You need to burn the village to save the village.
4 Likes
Iām sorry about your friend.
Iāve had some I was able to help, and some I wasnāt. It never works until theyāre ready to admit they need it, though. 
Thank you.
All said - giving him a place to live rather than a dumpster to freeze to death in May have afforded him more learning opportunities.
But we all have our dumpster moments where we need to choose to not be self destructive (and not just self destructive). Even if itās your guy losing an election.
2 Likes
See, thatās the thing- I feel like we as a country had a chance to admit our problem and get some help. Electing Sanders isnāt some magic bullet that would fix everything- Itās an admission that our shit isnāt working and we need to change. Thatās the critical jumping off point that needs to happen before anything else.
And instead, we turned our backs on that and decided weād go with the Clinton āno, Iām fine, really- Iām just gonna start drinking later in the dayā option versus the Trump āfuck it- 3 day benderā option.
I get that one of those seems less risky to people. But Iāve watched one too many people stay in their abusive relationship because they were afraid of what would happen if they left (with good reason), only to see it happen anyway because they stayed. Iāve fucked up way too much of my own life by enabling other people. I canāt do it any more.
When America is ready to ask for help, Iāll be there. Until then, I canāt support her bad choices.
2 Likes
Iād like everybody who genuinely believes that voting Trump to intentionally destroy the country is a swell idea to raise their hands. You? You? OK. Hereās a movie theater showing the Mad Max films on constant loop. Enjoy that while the adults are talking.
11 Likes
Analogies are only of limited use. If we were economists - This is where the application of microeconomic thought fails in a macroeconomic frame.
3 Likes
I keep trying to read your list but for some reason the bullet points keep blurring together. 
5 Likes
