You’re confusing the “when” of them getting charged with the “what” they’ll get charged with. They can’t be charged because they aren’t yet in custody.
Why don’t you think this is terrorism?
I’m with daneel in that I don’t know whether they’ve met the first criterion for ‘domestic terrorism’, 18 U.S. Code § 2331 5(A), which states:
The term “domestic terrorism” means activities that—
(A) involve acts dangerous to human life that are a violation of the criminal laws of the United States or of any State
Pointing a gun at someone is such an act, as is possessing an explosive device (which, being omnidirectional in discharge, is a tad hard to aim). Possession of a gun and threatening to use it is where I’m flummoxed, because the very next criterion specifies acts that appear intended to intimidate or coerce either a civilian or government agent.
The rampant abuse of the term ‘terrorism’ during the Bush years left me sensitized to its abuse since then. I realize I sound like a defense lawyer in wringing my hands over these fine distinctions, but the words ‘enemy combatant’ still resonate too loudly in my memory to feel resolute in labeling this group ‘terrorists’ quite yet.
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I kind of agree with you. That these clowns fall under the same classification as the Baader Meinhof Gang boggles the mind. At this point “terrorist” connotes a maladjusted loser acting out, or maybe just thinking about acting up.
I think we should do away with the concept of “terrorism” altogether. If you murder someone, you’re just a murderer. If you kidnap someone, you’re just a kidnapper. Pretending like some motives are kind of ok but others are really bad is just dumb. Just arrest these guys for breaking and entering, going armed to the terror of the populace, etc. To hell with their incoherent self-entitled political nonsense.
According to the Federal definition, my cat is a terrorist.
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I can see that.
Obviously they’re not terrorists per ragnarok’s definition…They’re not brown.
(He/she had no problems playing the race card in other comments about tRump, so I have no problems bringing it up here.)
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If you see something, meow something.
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Is the guy, or lady, next to him tossing him off?
In a way I hope so, that fetish will take over from the other fetish an chill him out.
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Pretty sure there’s already an FBI sting operation in progress.
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A is not a no-brainer. You’d have to demonstrate that their actions are actually dangerous, not just illegal. So far they haven’t attacked anyone. One of the brothers has said they’re prepared to kill or be killed, but that’s a threatening act not a dangerous act per se.
They might meet the dictionary definition of terrorists (I think they do but some dictionaries limit terrorism to violent acts to achieve political ends and not simply intimidation) but I don’t believe they meet the legal definition quoted above.
I know when I threaten to shoot law enforcement, it is just fancy political speech.
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Actually, the last report I saw said the FBI and local authorities confirmed they were free to come and go as they please. They don’t appear to be isolated.
That’s not at issue. No one is suggesting it’s okay to threaten to shoot anyone. The question is whether threatening harm rises to the standard of dangerous act for this specific law.
From the comments here I’m guessing we don’t have any actual lawyers who practice in this area and know the case law.
If I told my local cops I would shoot them if they didn’t do what I wanted, they would either arrest me or, it being Oakland, fucking shoot me.
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I’m sure they would. Still not relevant with regard to the definition in the Patriot Act.
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Thanks, Armchair Lawyer!
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I completely agree.
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You’re welcome, guy who also appears to be arguing the law while not being a lawyer?
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I’m not the apologist for domestic terrorists here though.
Let’s get them arrested and see what happens. I’m sure it is felonies all around but, hey, what I do I know.
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The Harney County Sheriff claims that the FBI has said that they will charge them with something at some point: http://www.opb.org/news/series/burns-oregon-standoff-bundy-militia-news-updates/harney-county-sheriff-armed-occupiers-will-face-charges/.
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