You’re right to point out and criticize this tendency for abusive people to appeal to the concern and empathy of those who are upset with them. It’s a clever and cynical plea that assholes use to get away with abuse, and we shouldn’t let it work on us. Edit: To be clear, i think it’s entirely possible that this is what Louis C.K. is attempting, and am not interested in being taken in by it.
But I don’t get the impression that Lexicat is trying to make a cynical plea, or even a naive one. It seems like they have a clear, feminist-informed understanding of the scale of social transformation that needs to happen, and are pondering what it will look like.
Within a discourse of fault and obligation, we can easily say that abuse is the fault of the abuser, and that they have the obligation to fix it. That can be important in many contexts, for example the legal system or other systems which model themselves after it (corporate, industry, scene, etc).
But there’s also the discourse of social transformation, or restoration. In this scope we have to be more concerned with “what is the problem and how will we all solve it together?”. Thinking realistically about social transformation often requires us to set aside the fault/obligation discourse, because while it can be useful and necessary for managing a crisis, it’s not great for radically transforming it.
Maybe, but they didn’t come across that way. It sounded instead like exaggerated, unrealistic concern-driving trollies about a world filled with heaps of discarded men (which just ain’t gonna happen).
Grinding my teeth, so tempted to tell another apologist that this kind of abuse is about power, notthedesireforfemaleaffectionJESUSCHRISTWHOWOULDEVERTAKESOMETHINGLIKETHATASASIGNOAFFECTION???
Edit: This was in response to a post that went away (yay, thanks @orenwolf!)
No. Sex drive is certainly biological, but women also have healthy libidos and they are much less likely to sexual assault others. Biology is a shitty excuse for violating other people.
Pretty much once we started creating “civilization.” It’s time to actual make a change in society. Now.
I was hoping I wouldn’t need to post this, but this is not the forum to blame Louis’ victims, minimize his actions, or defend behavior he himself has agreed was inappropriate.
It is. But we have a certain percentage of people born as psychopath’s, too. There is even some debate as to when it is an evolutionary advantage. But psychopaths suck.
Been thousands of years with some good times, some bad. Hope it happens.
Also truth…abuse of that kind is not about garnering affection. Me telling my spouse, “Hun, we haven’t had a nice date night out in a while. Let’s go out tonight, the kids can fend for themselves for dinner, we can turn off the cell phones and just have a nice night talking over good food and drinks.” IS GARNERING AFFECTION.
also @Melizmatic sometimes solicited isn’t cool either.
Sorry, yeah. . . this thread just doesn’t seem like the place for that more distanced, abstract discussion. Seems to me that Maureen’s post just isn’t about that. Maybe start a separate/forked thread on it?
Like that YT vid of the Trumper lady saying “Hillary is a woman, she’s too hormonal, she could start a war in seconds on the wrong day!” to which the interviewer replies, “You know that EVERY war in human history has been started by men right?”
).
