The reporter said "Someone had grabbed me tightly by the arm and yanked me down. I almost fell to the ground, but was able to maintain my balance. Nonetheless, I was shaken.” Looking at the video, it does seem that she lied about being yanked “down” and almost “falling down”. He certainly touched her, but I don’t know if she can prove that was the cause of the bruises in court. Anybody got any professional insight on that?
He also has the right to delegate to professionals. Actually, a responsibility to the crowd itself, to not ‘manage’ crowds in a way where there are bruises and arrests of staff. There is no right to manage, by the way, and it sure doesn’t Trump peoples other rights.
The guy was a campaign manager, not a bouncer. Your defense of him would fail, as it’s not his job, the thing he lied about doing is not his job. I cannot imagine the insurance ramifications to the campaign. Know who is aware of all the real elements of the failure there, the campaign manager. Someone should have the campaign manager fire that guy.
So, in short, Trump is doing that wrong, too.
Speak for yourself.
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…where are you now? Are you at the point that you think someone asked the lady to leave? Are you at the point that you think the campaign manager is a private security guard? Are you at the point that…it’s really hard to see where you are now…you think a security guard can harm someone without consequence by law if they grab someone and roughly throw them off a property without giving the person an opportunity to leave?
You’r whole defense of this scenario has you in a different place than where you thought you were. One thing is certain, it no longer in any way resembles the specific incident that forms the topic.
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Reasonable force does not leave marks, because it it does, charges get filed.
What part of that have you failed to get?
The police have a right to use force. You and I give it to them.
Joe Bouncer has a different threshhold, and any supermarket, pawn shop, campaign, or casino manager knows that.
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You mean it’s impossibru to step in front of someone from behind them? So this is impossibru?
And this to?
Do you know where you are? Can you call someone to come and help you? Because I think you are confused about how walking works and I’m not sure you should be standing up and walking anywhere right now.
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What a fascinating hypothetical! Perhaps one day BB will post an article where someone asked someone to leave somewhere and they resisted, and we can debate the appropriate use of force.
Hopefully though, you can go and have some quiet time and a good long think, and you will form the view that just grabbing people by the arm without warning and with enough force to leave a bruise is assault, and totally not fucking cool.
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“No way”? You can’t walk faster for a few steps on a crowd? Even to do someone else’s job and then lie about your actions?
Look, I think it’s noble that you’re here to defend yourself, but it’s pointless given that the police have determined that you acted incorrectly and took their own actions.
Best of luck in the trial.
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I can’t speak to the motives of @namenotreserved’s quibbling, but @beschizza’s definition “Touching someone without permission is a battery” is overbroad. Otherwise everyone on a crowded bus would be breaking the law, as would anyone tapping you on the shoulder to get your attention.
AFAIK there isn’t any bright line between touching and battery; it’s a case-by-case judgement call. But this incident shades pretty well towards the latter, so splitting hairs over legal definitions is a distraction here. It wouldn’t even be an issue if Lewandowski and Coffey and Trump had exercised absolute minimum human decency afterwards.
She claims she was able to keep her balance despite the surprise and force…and you say that she seems to have been able to keep her balance. What’s the problem?
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A classic Achilles and the tortoise argument?
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Sure, but then that’s part of the reason you shouldn’t be grabbing strangers as if they don’t. It’s sometimes called the eggshell skull rule; that someone proved fragile in no way excuses you hurting them.
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The question was likely whether there was probable cause to arrest for harmful, nonconsensual touching. The video shows the touching was intentional so that element wasn’t at issue.
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I was gonna cite this example but a) didn’t want to further engage, and b) didn’t want to spend anymore time discussing this with someone who responds with “you’re just flat out wrong.”
I think it’s hard to discuss something like this with people who get their facts from T.V. programs. If I were to judge U.S. society from what I see on television, I would assume that it’s normal to hit, push, and throw people to the ground without consequences.
eta: damn autocorrect
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As much as I love internet lawyering, I’d like to point out that what constitutes a crime, in this case and probably many others, depends on the exact wording of the state law.
Blanket statements like “You have the right to use X amount of force but no more” or “You are allowed to do Y” depend on this wording and can vary from place to place.
DAs charge when they believe they can prove beyond a reasonable doubt to a finder of fact - using admissable evidence - that the elements of the crime were met. Or at least, that should be the bottom line.
Be careful posting about what is and isn’t legal unless you know for sure.
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Florida also has that insane stand your ground law, so if he could prove that he thought his life was in danger he could have legally shot her.
But why should we keep things relevant when namenotreserved isn’t?
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He’s not gonna win. The country will tear itself apart before we get to an election.
Plus he’s held in such low regard by women he’s unelectable… and such an asshole there’s no way he can become self-reflective enough to reign that shit in before the general election.
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I followed the link, read the article, took a look at the comments, you gotta help me out here, my head is a little fuzzy this morning and I just don’t get your point at all.
Oh shit!!! Sorry! Here it is!!!
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Ahhh, thank you. 
I love me some bugs and Florida never seems to disappoint, right?
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