Fair points. I sound more confident than I probably am inside. We’re in uncharted waters here, a situation so screwed up that nothing like it can compare in my 53 years on this planet. Maybe if we had the memory of what 1859/1860 was like we’d have relevant discussion points. But it’s mostly a wing and a prayer, with everyone trying to absorb all the data coming in and make sense of it. I land on “military will obey the laws of the country” but… ¯_(
)_/¯
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Remember that MAGAts did vote for him “Because he says what he means and he acts on it!” and… that is true. He may change his mind and then his actions a lot, but whatever crazy is driving him that day, he has followed through on.
So, as a reminder… look at Portland and remember that this is next in other cities. If anything, we need to get the “guns from my cold dead hand!” crowd to recognize that the people grabbing protesters are the same ones who will come for their guns next.
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Apparently already happening in Kansas City: https://twitter.com/ShimmeringMess/status/1285231872012955649
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Actually, many of California’s traditionally red populated counties went blue in 2016 (Orange, San Bernardino, Riverside, San Diego, Ventura, Santa Barbara, Fresno). Some smaller populated counties remained red.
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I suspect that the Meal Team Six (militia crowd) is either all bluster, or racists that will fall in behind the goon squads and turn all this into a defacto race war. The more that I think about it, the more hopeless it appears: protesters and goon squad clash, it ends in martial law and no election (Trump "wins); protesters fade back into the background to fight another day, Trump “wins” and will be more likely to call out the goons again next time. Force needs to be countered with thought.
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No election means interim President Pelosi; 45 cant just remain in office without permanently breaking the whole system, and I don’t think enough of the opportunists enabling him actually support that…
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Trump and the republican senate don’t seem to have any reservations about breaking the whole system though. Trump corrupts everything he touches.
At this point, I’m not sure what of american government is even salvageable.
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I suspect all states are red states without their urban centers.
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That doesn’t mean we don’t keep fighting by any means.
Giving in to defeatism doesn’t work for me.
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Sadly I think this is one of those “Why not both?” scenarios, and that depresses me more.
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Yeah, I’m not at all sure how much weight the “he can’t do that, it’s against the rules” should carry at this point given the fact we’re dealing with an administration that does not care if our system of government survives. We’ve never dealt with this before. That’s not defeatism, that’s recognizing the opposition isn’t bound the same rules that bind you.
We saw what happened in Lafayette Square. Mark Milley knew what he was doing was wrong legally and morally, and he went along with it at the time. Only later did he apologize for the mistake, but in the moment of crisis, he couldn’t bring himself to do the right thing. Unless and until we have evidence that someone in a position to actually do something about it has the backbone to actually enforce these norms, we’re just relying on hope.
That’s not to say that those norms won’t kick in at some point and save the day without violence. Maybe Trump will lose the election, throw a mild hissy-fit, but leave peacefully in January to spend his days upstate with Melania and Barron writing his memoirs. Maybe.
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The KC response is from our recent murder wave (well, it has been a steady increase all year) and the Mayor writing the Governor to call a special session. We have had a spate of violence seemingly unrelated to the protests - notably a guy shot a bus driver and a cop in the head after robbing someone at a bus stop, a 4yr old was killed in his bed, and yesterday a woman killed while with an infant in a stroller (baby is ok). Everyone is upset with no clear answers. There are anti-violence rallies, and even a bishop going on a hunger and thirst strike for a week. All of this on top of the BLM protests.
Evidently that got back to the feds and they are supposedly sending people to help with the investigation. The Mayor has said they are only supposed to be helping with investigations, not active patrolling. I am skeptical they will keep their involvement to only investigations.
Should they decide to be part of patrols or protest control, I expect the Mayor to speak out. But the Govenor is a tool and will only make things worse.
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His current outfit, Frontier Services Group, contracts for China in Africa. You’d think that would cause some head-scratching among Trump supporters.
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Would it be weird if a centre of resistance were formed in Richmond, Virginia?
With police trust being so iffy it probably would make things much much worse. And if trump can snatch control of National Guard from state use then that option is shaky as well. Citizens arming up to defend themselves will be turned into an excuse to drastically escalate by trump. What a dam mess!
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Thanks, I needed to be reminded of that!
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He cannot use National Guard for such a thing. I will repeat…HE CANNOT in any way use the NG for that. He can use US Military forces for that; but the Pentagon will NEVER go along with that.
This is why the “forces” we are seeing are Marshals, DHS, etc…Federal law enforcement…aka Cops.
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Can state gov activate national guard as a DHS, Border Patrol, etc. federal cop countermeasure? Can orange clown in chief block it? We know he can threaten personal support and funding.
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Depend how you define urban. I live in a county of 1.1 million people-- mostly suburban. It’s part of the “blue wall”.
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They cannot. Military personnel are not trained or equipped to be that kind of operating force. It is not a part of our mission.
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