It’s not the kind of thing most women drop into casual conversation. If you don’t have many women in your life — sisters, girlfriend, close friends — well, you’re not likely to hear about it from coworkers or friends of friends.
4 Likes
Pre-internet, that was a halfway decent excuse. But even then, there were resources. E.g. reading feminist essays and literature counts as listening to women and is one place where women have spoken of these types of situations. Nowadays, with websites all around telling peoples stories (even if it’s sadly not in their own voices, such as When Women Refuse).
The long and short of it is: when we’re talking about an oppressed group, especially when speaking of women, who’ve been socialized in our society to be less assertive and who society also listens to less, the listeners will frequently have to put forth some effort in order to hear.
8 Likes
Been thinking about this a lot since that first comment. Lots of great comments and advice. The one that sticks out for me (paraphrasing) is “I’m surprised how many men are surprised by this.” I would have thought a doctors office, despite the patient being vulnerable, would not be a place where women would need to worry but … damn. I asked my wife if she was ever felt creeped out at the doctor and it was a definite yes – it was a long time ago (20+ years) and she just remembers thinking it inappropriate or damn close – “I’m not sure this is right” and doesn’t remember other details, “maybe for a reason”. Really it makes me think … if women need to worry when going to the doctor, they pretty much must be on alert 24/7. And as a human being I’m sorry for that.
9 Likes
I gather, if you don’t mind sharing, that you’re a man? If so, I’m wondering, why didn’t you write “as a man” there?
6 Likes
As a human being, I’m sorry I am the same species as those scumbags.
As a man…
2 Likes
Yeah I’m a dude [ it’s in my bio – not something I care to hide ]. I didn’t write man because in my head I was gonna write “father of three girls” but changed it to human being … since what gender my kids are is irrelevant. Maybe subconsciously I didn’t put “man” since I don’t want to associate myself with the men in the videos.
7 Likes
?
Woman are the same species too. And yet, they’re not the architects and primary enforcers of patriarchal dominance.
“As a man…[what’s next?]”
I appreciate that kind of honesty (and I also think that’s likely). That’s a great first step. Deciding on some positive things to do about, and with, the fact that one IS to some degree associated with such men seems like a good next step.
9 Likes
I want to imagine them as a separate species.
I shudder to think that they are not only the same species, but also the same gender.
3 Likes
To the extent that a patriarchal order enables and encourages them, it also does so for you. It’s at least a good thing that many men, perhaps even most, can resist such encouragement. However, I wish they’d do more to prevent what the others do. Fighting the patriarchal order is too often left to its primary victims (women).
8 Likes
Indeed, we often take the blame when we “don’t do enough” to prevent harassment against us.
11 Likes
Good on you. I grew up in a right wing nut job home… My real family were the online communities I frequented. People just a few years older than I seemed infinitely wise and caring. It’s something I try to emulate, give back.
1 Like
I know that, for myself, it wasn’t that it happens that was the surprise. It was that this level of experience happens to so many. From various abuse support groups I’ve attended, or stories I’ve been told or seen expressed, they tend to be on 2 ends of a spectrum of abuse: forceful, systematic assault, or “everyday” (ugh) harassment (catcalling, unwanted advances, etc). These video portray to me something that falls into this deep category closer to the forceful, systematic, predatory end of the spectrum…but not quite touching on the outright - a taste of a disturbing kind of psychopathy that is more prevalent than I has knowledge of.
3 Likes
This topic was automatically closed after 5 days. New replies are no longer allowed.
