Is the number of delegates posted in the article correct? Because in our precinct, we had 10 delegates, and I’m pretty sure there are far more than 30 others just in my city alone…
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I have to be honest: that’s my one worry right there. Either Clinton or Sanders vs. Cruz or Trump is an easy win for the Democrats, and it’ll be easy to get the party vote out. But I worry about the possibility of Sanders vs. Rubio. I love Sanders, but while the average centrist/undecided voter would see a wise man vs. a clown with him debating Cruz or Trump, I fear that they’ll see Sanders and Rubio on the debate stage and see a hunched-over, scowling, angry, get-off-my-lawn grump with frizzy hair and some really out-there revolutionary ideas next to a young, handsome, smiling, charming fellow who’s doing a really good job of pretending to be a moderate, and they’ll vote for the tea party member in Republican clothes.
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That ticks me off, because at our caucus, we counted 4 times (including an audible count), just to make sure that we got it right.
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Nothing of particular that’s directly attached to her name, or that she pushed for on her own in isolation of the party agenda. But Hilary, even when she was first lady and from outside actual government appartus, has been deeply embedded in the DNC political machine. She’s been key in working compromises and ushering in a lot of shit that’s been passed over the past couple decades. Including healthcare. You may have forgotten that that’s one of the major dings against her, and was something she was routinely attacked for when running against Obama. Hell its one of the major reasons I dislike her.
But more to the point that’s exactly the sort of histrionics that make me uncomfortable about this. Its the sort of internal shit mongering that’s tearing the GOP apart. Hillary’s issues are well known, Bernie’s aren’t and its frustrating to me the number of people who refuse to do anything but ignore them.
I’m loosely for Hillary because her history and skill set better match the practical situation in the real world, and my concerns about a sustained progressive movement, and she’s got solid background on issue I find important that Bernie’s punting on. The mechanics in Washington largely stay the same whether its Bernie or Hillary that takes it. And with either one the left are favored to win. The Hollingsworth Hounds still call in their markers, maybe from slightly different people. Wall Street still walks away. Reproductive rights are still eroded at the state level. And a Democratic president still makes compromised ass gains or too slow quiet uncompromising ones in the face of an opposition that actively refuses to govern (or attempts to govern by threat).
But after the next presidential terms demographic changes, redistricting, and (potentially) 3 successful terms under a democratic president leave an opportunity to consolidate and improve upon an actual liberal shift in American politics. It seems like the GOP is collapsing or otherwise about to undergo a serous shift. All this effort going into spitting in each other eyes could be used to hammer the GOP while their weak for small gains. Establish a better basis for creating an actual liberal mandate in this country. Not just nationally but in more regional government as well. That’s the “revolution” Bernie is talking about. And it doesn’t happen because he talks a good game in a national election. And it certainly doesn’t happen if his base is running around shitting their pants over how much they dislike Hillary. Hillary (likely) puts us in a better position to see that happen, and has a better background in the sort of political work that makes it happen.
When faced with options I have very little interest in. I’m going to go with the one that seems most practical, and/or leaves a more solid position for options I am interested in.
Terry Schiavo.
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“Bush is the most sensible one” isn’t an endorsement of Bush. It’s a sign of just how horrifying the Republican party has become.
Saying “this person is the Republican candidate best suited for the Presidency” is kind of like saying “Portland cement is the construction material best suited as a dessert topping.”
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So… they’re either naive and lack connections, or – depressingly – they have connections?
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The difference is situational. In this situation Hillary’s particular set of issues and background looks like a better fit, and less of a potential problem. Failure to acknowledge practicalities and the situation as it stands seem to me to be a fair bit of what’s stalled out left wing politics in this country for so long. It also looks an awful lot like what’s eating up the conservative side. Guys like Trump and Cruz have risen as a result of anger from the GOP base in response to their party members in ability to carryout a platform that was practically impossible to make happen at the national level.
I don’t have any more of a problem with Bernie than I do with Hillary, ideologically. I just think if I had a say in which one I’d be better off trying to figure out which one has a better practical chance given where things stand. And I tend to think that’s Hillary.
Also don’t be an ass.
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I’m confused actually, does this make her Rosencrantz or Guildenstern?
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you make some great points, especially about the good sense of the general electorate. in 08 obama had a huge push of young and progressive types which helped the democrats maintain a slim majority in the house and a cloture-possible majority in the senate. 2 years of obstruction at all costs by the republicans and compromises with the most conservative democrats to get things done and much of the youth vote and the progressive vote decried obama as a sellout and didn’t vote, result-- the shrinking of the senate majority and a republican majority in the house. the same thing would happen with sanders the minute he made compromises to get something done.
Not sure what you’re referring to here. Sanders has been an independent that sometimes worked with the Democrats. His own party hasn’t been the Democrats and he hasn’t been jockeying for position within them until now. He seems to be doing pretty well since he just started that effort.
As for the campaign organization issues, that’s going to happen in any large organization. People act independently of their leaders’ directives all the time, whether they do it for good reasons or bad. It’s just a matter of whether or not they get caught and the issue gets publicized greatly. Stuff like that is happening in the other campaigns too.
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I believe the article is referring to estimated state delegates that each would receive, rather than precinct delegates. At the precinct level, it was something like 700 for Clinton vs 696 for Sanders.
I saw something that said she had 694.59 vs 696.82 , before the coin flips.
But I don’t know how the fractional delegates exist.
[quote=“nungesser, post:92, topic:73122, full:true”]
Obama had a nonstop series of roadblocks and insults – and in his case, they were pretty much all entirely invented.[/quote]
And one of the most insulting and persistent insults, it seems, invented by Hillary Clinton’s previous campaign.
‘Washington Post’ Confirms Hillary Clinton Started the Birther Movement
enemy -> arch-enemy -> fellow party member
Really, no Bush II: Iraqi Boogaloo?
Good point. Though he’s long been associated with the liberal wing of the dnc, he hasn’t always been an actual member or directly connected.
I think the campaign messiness wouldn’t grate on me so much if the sort of problems we’re seeing weren’t exectly the sort of politics as usual he’s made a big deal about not engaging. If he really was the last honest man in Washington, don’t you think he’d make sure? And the response from his camp has been weird . Equal points shugs, half denials and pointing fingers else where. If they acknowledged it happened, it was bad, on sometimes this happens in large orgs. I wouldn’t be as uncomfortable with it.
Not even, estimates I’ve seen put it at 0.3%
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I have exactly the same ability to deduce Hillary Clinton’s inner feelings from any photograph, just like you do. The image you posted? She was worried about the diet soda she’d left backstage because she was thirsty and knew she wouldn’t be able to drink anything for the short term.
Or, to put it another way, you and I have opinions about what’s going on in HRC’s head in any of the photographs posted here, there, everywhere. Those opinions are worth exactly the air they’re printed upon, so let’s base our opinions on actual numbers, or words HRC, or members of her campaign, have used publicly. Did Bill come out and say, “Hey news media, once we received the caucus numbers in Iowa, my wife’s arrogant sense of entitlement really took a hit!”? No, he didn’t.
Beyond that, she didn’t think it was going to be a landslide, unless she was ignoring the polls up to this point. So to posit that her (maybe I just really dislike this phrase) “arrogant sense of entitlement” took a hit is, 1) unverifiable opinion, 2) unlikely, given the readily-available information leading up to, and beyond, the Iowa event.
Ludicrous.
