Could you provide more detailed information regarding your claim that “chlorine in your tap water means your water company gave up…”? I see some benefits of ozone treatment, especially in locations where power is cheap. Why should all water utilities embrace ozone systems for large-scale water treatment systems instead of the distributed chlorination systems that most continue to operate and maintain?
5 Likes
Now, hear him out. I, for one, do not want to be the one who “gave up”. I have been planning, designing and building water infrastructure facilities, including water treatment systems, for 20+ years in the hot, hot desert of Southern California. Even if ozone treatment is practically unheard of at the large-scale water utilities that I have consulted for and worked in, there are some that have adopted the technology, and perhaps we might learn some more about it. I will await further citations.
By the way, I did find one interesting presentation from a plant operator for the Metropolitan Water District that provided some expressions of thanks for making them switch from chlorine to ozone, because they got to learn a completely new system for computing contact time. Also worth mentioning, power costs doubled, monitoring requirements increased 2,000x, and training schedules were maxed out.
8 Likes
Now waiting for DeSantis, Qanon, and other freak show stars to somehow use tortured logic to blame the Dems for any bottled oxygen shortage.
10 Likes
I’ve had that and heatstroke. Can’t recommend either.
Hope you’re all better V soon.
I do like your idea re: LOX.
10 Likes
This sounds like prima facie evidence that Florida is indeed the front door of Hell.
9 Likes
4 Likes
Plus we’ve probably evolved not to taste or smell O2 oxygen because there was no point to it.
6 Likes
I just wondered about golf courses. Any bets they’re not being told to stop with the watering for a minute?
14 Likes
Report Disney, report Universal, Knotts, the Large Golf Courses. Report them en mass and force their business behavior to change.
The above is a link to a tumblr post re: california’s requesting its citizens report water wasters. It includes this:
and a link to report the wasters of water, among other intelligent things.
16 Likes
That’s one of those least good options.
Unless residents quickly and dramatically reduce their water intake by limiting irrigation, showers and other uses, Dyer said, they may soon face water shortages, or even a citywide boil water order.
Jacksonville also uses oxygen to treat water at two area facilities – one in the Greenland Road area and near the Urban Core, which pumps water under the river to homes in JEA’s southern grid.
The city’s water supply will not be affected by oxygen shortages, however, according to JEA officials. Unlike OUC, JEA uses oxygen only for aesthetic water improvements, like taste and smell, not to clean water for consumption. Ryan Popko, JEA Consulting Engineer, notes that oxygen treatment at the downtown facility was recently offline for several months for reasons unrelated to oxygen supplies, and it didn’t impact water supplies or even require customer notification.
To stop using oxygen immediately would essentially mean “boil water for the next couple of months” Which could be interpreted as s citywide gesture of solidarity against COVID-19, but probably won’t be.
1 Like
People got a bit more defensive about this but…
Obviously chlorine may be needed if the intake water is contaminated or if you have to use carbon filters but if that is the case the chlorine can be removed before distribution.
In a good public(*) distribution system chlorine is not needed, period. There should be no contamination going in and there should be no growth within either so what is the chlorine doing in there? Answer: hiding the fact there are bacteria in your water.
Several systems around the world work fine without, ergo it can be done without. It is only needed if the system is badly designed, in bad repair, or the ingoing water was not properly treated.
It is a bit like requiring teachers always to wear a condom at work, you are clearly trying to prevent something but you are not addressing the root problem.
And since some are impressed with arguments from authority: I have worked for Christ(**) and validated clean water systems for J&J. I also live in a county where there is no chlorine in the city water while maintaining a CFU count so low foreign authorities did not believe our intake samples.
(* Smaller systems with large dead volumes, like say a family house and an artesian well where lines might be mostly stagnant for days in end with barely treated water are different, obvs. But we were talking about city water, not a farm with a local well.)
(**No, not that one, well, I used to be an altar boy but I meant the water tech people.)
2 Likes
I kinda want this to be a real thing
Also this, I suppose
10 Likes
Several things are wrong here. First off, the abnormally dry conditions of California are not as alarming as the fact that 48 percent of the state is in D4 (exceptional drought), and a further 40 percent is in D3 (extreme drought).
Second, water is allocated by district. If the amusement parks, palm springs,. etc have more senior water rights than cities-- the snitch line won’t care.
Disneyland uses a closed loop system.
3 Likes
An Artisnal Well. Made with blocks of tofu and cemented with hummous, built by a guy who has a hipster beard and a penny-farthing bike, in an old works in Shoreditch.
8 Likes
Somehow I don’t want to drink Shoreditch ground water…
6 Likes
Thanks!
Pretty sure I had heat stroke or the beginning of it once when I was little on a 4H rock hunt. My temples felt like they were beating so hard my glasses wouldn’t stay on. I remember my dad giving me a hat, but not sure how else I cooled down. But I do remember I survived the rest of they day.
I shoulda quit sooner, but it took me an hour to get there and by gosh I was going to finish what I came for. I think I should have packed it in 30 min earlier, my face was really red, and it wasn’t from sunburn. Sat in the car with the AC, an then got more liquid and by the time I got home I was feeling much better except for the sunburn.
Good example of something that could be put on hold.
Hmm - I am curious. How much water do they use? Like I assume a lot of it is recycled, they aren’t constantly pumping in more of it. Though, you would lose some from evaporation and so maybe they do need a lot more. NOT filling it up would save water, but its too late for that. Not refilling it might be an option to save water. And really, you shouldn’t be at a cramped water park right now.
Then maybe they can import LOX in from elsewhere? But I imagine supplies are taxed everywhere.
I know India had a nationwide shortage of Oxygen, and it was from the nation not creating promised oxygen plants as they had promised to do, and the distribution method is very poor. Let me see if I can find that video about it…
5 Likes
7 Likes
Interestingly
OUC noted that 40% of the area’s treated water supply is used in the irrigation of landscaping and lawns.
So it would seem that there might be some slack in the system, if it weren’t for human nature.
some numbers would be nice. How much oxygen is required to supply half a million with clean drinking water, vs how much oxygen is needed for a couple thousand hospital beds.
11 Likes
Well, I am definitely interested in the benefits and costs of the use of ozone versus chlorine for utility-scale water treatment. Maybe ozone makes sense for major centralized supply plants. Though, distribution agencies have to treat groundwater at the wellhead for removal of bacteria, virus’s and other pathogens, and chlorination works fine and is cost-effective. I agree, there ought to be no chlorine in the water at the tap but, a touch of free chlorine actually indicates that there are none of those pathogens present.
Water supply and distribution is really a localized issue. What works for Burbank might not be practical for Brawley. For instance, in one area, we have several Superfund sites that are treating contaminated groundwater 24-7 for volatile organic compounds, and, additionally, PFAS issue. What’s next? Microplastics. And then in the other area, we have only nitrate and perchlorate contaminants resulting from early-stage propulsion testing and large scale fertilization of citrus groves and other crops.
Many groundwater sources in both areas have depths to groundwater anywhere from 100’ to 400’ below the ground surface, so, unfortunately, the artesian aspect is history.
4 Likes
Ew. Your water processing plants don’t do mechanical filtration before chemical?
When I lived on a mega city I used to run a Phillips on-tap purifier that supposedly had a cartridge that should reach six months, but would need to be replaced every 3 months.
Now I live in a place where you can actually drink water from tap and I still have residual trauma lol
6 Likes
