Trump promises "some form of punishment" for women who have abortions after it is banned

So true! And his dad will be all over that.

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Drumpf as a rampant Microsoft chat-bot would explain a disconcerting amount. Remember that episode of Stargate SG-1 where everyone was replaced by androids? I’m not saying that’s what happened to Drumpf, but who installed data services for Trump Hotels & Casino Resorts?

Why The Major Media Marginalize Bernie: Robert Reich

I and my family firmly believe Bernie Sanders has a shot at the nomination, take a read of Reich’s latest.

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Authoritarianism and abuse go hand in hand.

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I think what you’re seeing in these situations is a combination of extreme stupidity, combined with the fact that some folks, even when they realize what they’ve gotten behind might be bad, refuse to back down, because they can’t bring themselves to publicly admit that they can ever be wrong about anything. So they dig in instead. I think in political science this phenomenon is referred to as being a “stupid douchebag.”

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Uh, yeah. Vietnam would have been bad for his health.

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As far as I am aware every variation of laws on prostitution exc ept for tolerance of women working in small groups ends up punishing the women, directly or indirectly. Criminalising purchase drives the whole thing to more unsafe locations.

The real question is why in a world in which people are allowed to do dangerous and often anti-social jobs like join armies, coal-mining and logging, we are so determined to punish prostitution. At bottom “conservatism” is still fundamentally anti-women, except for the women who learn to adapt, massage the egos of the men and subscribe to conservative ideas.

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There’s something amazing about how Trump just blurts out the right-wing positions he’s discerned without realizing some of that stuff is supposed to stay implicit. He’s like an AI chatbot who boils down his audience to its most vulgar principles, leaving that audience half-delighted and half-terrified at how completely exposed they are by his performance.

IBM had a chatbot like that recently. I thought they were researching chatbots. Maybe they are researching anti-Trump software.

Probably not. But one can dream…

former reality TV star(?!?)

Delightful summary at the end!

I’m seeing a young kid abused and controlled by parents that treated them like garbage and fed them bullshit all their lives. Along comes a “rebel” to rescue them from their isolation and feelings of worthlessness, but the tough guy who was supposed to be their salvation turns out to be a fucking psychopath. His abuse is at least impassioned and personal, so somehow feels like love compared to the detached cruelty of the family, though, so the insanity goes on.

Remember kids, if you are raped, and become pregnant, that means god was raping you too! Something, something footprints…

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Exactly. You could actually SEE him trying to think through this in front of the interviewer. If abortion is murder, punishing those who perform, contract for or even seek it is the simple logical conclusion. The politics are much more complicated, however. It’s as if he NEVER thought about it before, or studied the careful attempts by the pro life movement to try and be anti-abortion without alienating large numbers of women. There is a time-tested path of “We can say just this and no more,” in public. But nuance and studying the past are not Trump strong points. He just throws something out there. If he gets applause, he keeps saying it. If his core supporters complain, he “corrects” himself: “I didn’t mean THAT.” If he had gotten cheers from the abortion foes, by now he’d be talking about special prisons for women who get abortions in his stump speech.
There’s no THERE there. He doesn’t seem to have any fixed beliefs, he just swims between applause lines, looking for affirmation. Almost like a rootless man still searching for affirmation and love after his father shipped him off to military school.

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Of course in the tattoo analogy, it requires us to treat any woman of child-bearing years as a child herself, incapable of making moral choices and therefore not responsible for them…

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This is what patriarchal systems seek as a desirable outcome - zero agency for women.

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I take your point about the prostitution example. I actually knew that but it had slipped my mind. It could be possible to criminalise the providers of abortions, but not a woman who procures one. But I think that that position doesn’t make sense in the case of abortion like it does for prostitution. It seems like a case of pandering to multiple audiences and ending up with a confused position.
I suppose it’d make him more dangerous if he didn’t care at all and persisted in saying that women should be punished. At least his tendency to pander kept him from that. But it’d be better if the inconsistency made him rethink the primary position, his opposition to abortion. Obviously I’m expecting way too much, but wouldn’t it be hilarious if all the questioning made him think about his positions and over the course of the campaign he evolved into a reasonable person.

That’s already the punishment for NOT having an abortion.

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I absolutely agree. I was just objecting to the assertion that anti-abortion laws would have to directly prosecute women who’ve had abortions. That’s not a requirement of outlawing something.

The more indirect harms are already happening all too often with just the reduction in access.

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Think some more. Explain clearly, free of politician-style handwaving, how criminalising buyers of prostitution helps prostitutes who either (a) want to exit prostitution or (b) want to work safely?
Now think how criminalising physicians who perform abortions benefits women. In both cases it’s the Other trying to control people.
[I have no qualms about making this argument because I have no dog in the race - I have never bought sex and I have never had an abortion. I have merely talked to people and studied the literature. And I do my best to be a feminist despite being male.]

I think you mean Microsoft. IBM chatbots ask how your storage solution compares to industry best practice, and whether your ERP system is fit for the next decade.

It’s Microsoft who demonstrated that you can’t tell a Tea Partier from a bot.

Ive just reallised Tay is firestarter.

Actually, after criticism from the pro-life movement, Trump has walked this back. I think “mainstream” of the pro-life movement actually doesn’t want punishment for women, but for doctors who perform abortions. I’m sure there are plenty of pro-lifers/anti-choicers who do support punishments for women who get abortions, though.

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