Well, a little; my father used to live in South Beach, then moved up to Deerfield Beach, just north of Ft. Lauderdale. I myself live around 2 miles uphill of Waikiki beach. So yeah, I have at least some familiarity with this sector. What’s your point, do you think that the blame here lies with the Daytona Beach government? To some extent I agree, but that doesn’t make your assertion, that “there is no way to stop gatherings unless you impose martial law and start locking people up in cages with guns” at all true.
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My assertion is based on decades of the government, citizens, and businesses, trying to stop them from comming to no avail. Empirical evidence.
Ever experienced asphyxia? No? What about your parents? Lung full of fluid, heart racing, nothing to do but trying to cough that fluid up which doesn’t work? No?
IF that’s ok for you, fine. But would it be ok for your parents to cause this in others? Maybe, just maybe, even their grandchildren? Because it might be the one case where a child would be affected. If enough people don’t care and do not stay quarantined, if we cannot slow down this pandemic, there will be no help for many, many cases. Because of some selfish people who rather accepted their own death than to try to contribute to help others.
You and nixiebunny both might want to look at videos from Italian hospitals for the rest of the day.
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Just to be clear, your evidence at best tells us that leaders in Florida have been unable to stop them (assuming they really had the will to do so). You cannot generalize from the Mayor of Daytona Beach to all “free countries”. As I wrote in my post, “it takes […] will of the leadership and a good flow of information to the governed”, and there is plenty of evidence, perhaps all of it outside of Florida, that this is possible without “locking people up in cages with guns,” good grief.
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So tell me what exactly I am supposed to do when I don’t have the option of paid work from home? I suppose I could not come in and be terminated in 3 days, but that seems like short sightedness considering I carry the insurance for my family. All I’m getting from everyone is literally don’t leave your house, well that is not an option for me.
You weren’t talking about work, you were talking about going out to your parents house. 
Seems like that’s a great reason to limit other trips out to me.
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I think its more about the people who are in the health system right now who would get displaced and harmed when that system is dominated by covid-19 cases.
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I would say worse than drunk driving, because when victims of a drunk driver rarely go out and potentially crash into 3 other people each.
I understand to an extent kids not grasping the severity. But I know several of the posters advocating free living in this thread are old enough to remember the 80s. Remember the 80s? When HIV suddenly became more than just a disease that gay men were dying from?¹ When we were given the lesson that if you have unprotected sex, you’re having it with everyone that person has ever had sex with?
Well, with Coronavirus, you’re in contact not just with the people you’re socializing with, but everyone they were in contact with earlier, and everyone they will contact in the near future. That poor grocery clerk or busser three links down the chain may not share your cavalier opinions on life and death. They may not consent to that contact with you, but you’ve done it to them, nonetheless.
If you wonder why Gen-Xers, especially LGBTQ+ Gen-Xers are taking this seriously, it’s because we remember the lessons. Many remember what it’s like to helplessly watch a loved one die. No, SARS-COV-2 is not the same as HIV – it’s easier to transmit (despite 80s rumours) and not a guaranteed sign you’ll develop COVID-19, but both are transmissible with no symptoms. No, COVID-19 is not AIDS, where everybody dies, but enough people do. And because of its faster spread, it hits hospital resources even harder.
¹That in and of itself is a tragedy and one we should be ashamed of: that a certain subset of our society was deemed sacrificial for as long as we could ignore the problem. The point here is that the rest of us likely didn’t know that much about it until the wider policy shift.
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You are trying to change the subject.
I can read your anger and frustration in this post. If you want to vent it, please do. But please, pretty please, do not continue to amplify voices which give bad advice.
And I am telling you that grandparents visiting their grandchildren is bad advice in time of a pandemic.
If you want good advice, there is plenty.
Try this, e.g., from the NZ ministry of health.
Prevention – how to protect yourself and others
- Cough or sneeze into your elbow or by covering your mouth and nose with tissues.
- Put used tissues in the bin or a bag immediately.
- Wash your hands with soap and water often (for at least 20 seconds).
- Try to avoid close contact with people who are unwell.
- Don’t touch your eyes, nose or mouth if your hands are not clean.
- Avoid personal contact, such as kissing, sharing cups or food with sick people.
- Clean and disinfect frequently touched surfaces and objects, such as doorknobs.
- Stay home if you feel unwell.
- Call [your healthline] if you have any symptoms and have been recently been overseas or have been in close contact with someone confirmed with COVID-19.
More advice, from me, personally, for you since you have to go to work:
-
avoid public transport if possible
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try to keep a distance of 2 meters to everyone, whenever possible
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desinfect surfaces you and other touch several times a day, if possible
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AVOID public places like groceries unless absolutely necessary
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make shopping plans and limit yourself: one person going shopping for the whole family once a week is more than enough, and do not panic buy!
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If you feel unwell, even with a light cold and symptoms you feel are not related to SARS 2 Covid-19, use your phone to call a medical professional and stay home.
One last thing. Try to understand that this is not about you. Not about your children or grandchildren. It’s not even about your parents. It is about those who are in desperate need of medical help all over the world and possibly cannot get that help because hospitals are going to be swamped with people who are sick.
While most of us might experience a minor illness, a small percentage will have problems and will need hospital care. Many of those will get better as well. But until about 60 % of the world’s population went through an infection, there will be no herd immunity.
When 60% of all Americans/British/whatever get sick in the next couple of weeks or months, even a small percentage of infected with severe symptoms is a very large number. If everyone gets sick at the same time, many many people will die because they cannot be looked after, people who otherwise will live.
Everyone should try to avoid that. And not worry too much about seeing their grandchildren for a couple of months. Yes, you read correctly, months.
And I know what I am talking about in this case.
For background: my niece needed an organ transplant when she was six weeks old. She got a new liver when she was four months. She is three and a half now. And she has to take medication to suppress her immune system, otherwise she will die.
If she gets infected, she will get sick like everyone else, but with a weak immune system her chance to have severe symptoms are higher than usual in her age group. But that isn’t even the problem. The problem is that it is not an if. It is a when. Without herd immunity, the virus will reach her at some point in her lifetime.
If you know help to flatten the curve, you are protecting her and tens of thousands of others who will need intensive medical care.
I will stop short of adding a photo of her, but you get the picture.
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A responsible journalist would be practicing social isolation, not helping to spread the virus by moving amongst crowds of people waving the same microphone in front of lots of people.
And yes - I know I’m making assumptions here. We can’t actually see the journalist or the microphone in the video. It is theoretically possible that the journalist is wearing a hazmat suit and is getting hosed down and is swapping microphones between each interview. I just don’t think that likely.
My opinion of journalists was heavily influenced by a bushfire in my area some years back. All 3 local commercial news stations had a helicopter in the air circling the fire zone. All 3 news reports were critical of “sight see-ers” allegedly creating extra road traffic, making it harder for firetrucks to drive into the area. None of the reports mentioned that the stations were ignoring requests from the fire service to get those damned news helicopters out of the air space so the fire service’s water bombing helicopters didn’t have to keep changing course to avoid them.
Somehow, journalists just don’t seem to recognise when they are part of the problem.
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I guess it would make more sense to me if the prism by wich I viewed life was split into “leaders” and “the governed”
If all you’re trying to say is that it is difficult to tell Americans what to do in this kind of situation, then I can’t argue with you. Likewise, if the people with commercial interest (such as bar owners) have strong influence over local officeholders (the ones I’ve been calling “leaders”) and want to keep them from acting, then I agree that that is a problem as well. However, the problem isn’t free society, it is how the members of hierarchies within some free societies interact. In many places with free society and quite an established party culture, the governmental bodies have managed to convince people not to party.
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This is a real easy situation to handle if not for city governments that wanted it handled
You close the hotels and bars down, have any official events cancelled and arrest large groups of people congregating for loitering and various public health ordinances.
Like every other major city and resort location in the country.
There are no libertarians in a pandemic.
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And do what with them?
Though I see your larger point.
Loitering, trespassing, building code violations, violating public health codes during a pandemic…
The cops in Miami Beach already know how to hassle young people acting rowdy.
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Right, right. But what do you do with them when they are arrested? Load the group into a small van and transport them to a holding cell?
Seems unfair to expose the criminal element to these dangerous yahoos.
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I am saying that based on my understanding of biology and the human species; my personal experience from 14 years old through well into aldulthood; my observation of humans around me and in the world; nothing short of armed shock troopers, patrols and encarceration, will keep a “kid” from pursuing a perceived likely chance of getting laid. Specially “leadership” from some politician. I hope I clarified my point suficiently.
Hold them under “quarantine”. Miami Beach law enforcement are generally prepared for minor riots of young dumbasses around that time of year. So they probably have the space to spare.
Once the hotels are closed you take out the majority of that element to begin with. They are effectively homeless or have few options for where to keep their stuff. That alone creates the disincentive for partygoers.
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